Thanks. In theory, even if it displays sites like IE7 (though knowing Microsoft, I'm not counting on it) then it should be no problem assuming the site is compatible with IE7. I could quite easily be wrong though, it is M$ who we're dealing with
Why would you want a (hopefully) standards compliant browser to act as if it's broken? Write your pages for good browsers, and hack for IE≤7. There is no benefit to going down that road. cheers, gary
It's not acting like its broken, its displaying the same as IE7. So if it works in IE7, it'll work in IE8. Because its in beta stage, testing in IE8 is not accurate as when the public version is released it could render different (i.e. incorrectly)
This is Microsoft...it'll be standards compliant, but not like Opera or Firefox - in that it will display differently, and (last time I checked), CSS2 non standard stuff such as opacity, has been removed, though there was outrge from this, si they might've put it back in.
I should note I only intend to use this until the full version is released... it's a "fallback" basically, in case it displays incorrectly in IE8 (and as the client is long gone, its not like I can fix it - they'll just see a poorly displaying site and blame the coder) The other alternative is hack for IE8, then hope and pray they don't change anything between beta->public versions... EDIT: Damn, there is so much rubbish and conflicting opinions. This guy: http://ejohn.org/blog/html5-doctype/ Put HTML5 doctype, but then write everything using HTML4, and the little magic fairy will make it become HTML5 when its actually implemented in browsers... right. This guy: http://www.adaptavist.com/display/~gfraser/2008/01/24/Microsoft+IE8+Hack+Tag Screw IE, if it doesn't work, it doesn't work.
what the hell are you doing? IE8 is in beta just now. It shouldn't be used to test sites agains't, it's not finished.
IE7 is a broken browser, albeit slightly less broken than 6 and a lot less broken than 5. IE7 lacks support for about 25% of what modern browsers do support, and it still has hasLayout. If a page works in modern browsers it will, we all hope, work in IE8. IE8 will expand support of css to near complete, and will do away with hasLayout. These will make significant differences. The point of beta releases is to test the application, not to test jury-rigged pages against it. Write well formed, well structured and semantic pages, and apply css rulesets and selectors as they are meant to be used. Report the bugs to MSFT. cheers, gary
Which is my point. When it is released, I don't want my clients sites to look like trash in them. As long as the page displays correctly in it, it doesn't matter how bad the browser is. If that actually worked then the world would be a much better place. You can write perfect HTML & CSS, and it'll still screw up in certain *cough IE cough* browsers. Add in a bit of persuasion, and they comply. That is my entire point - who the hell knows what IE8 will do. Microsoft say it will be standards compliant, but jesus christ after 7 failed browsers, can you not see the trend? Which leads back to my original point. Is it that bad to make IE8 display like IE7 (as then it is 100% assured to work properly when IE8 is released) for the sites coded at the current point in time, until IE8 is released and sites can be tested properly on it without requiring the meta tag.
IE8 rendering is broken, also there will be a new release this august (MS announced) Alright, I'll throw in a little secret which I use a lot in freelancing http://dean.edwards.name/IE7/ is a javascript enhancement that will make IE browsers behave correctly (read the page as there is a new beta version) it also has some IE8 enhancements but its kinda useless to use since IE8 will keep changing eventually * silly links*
Nice. I'm sure browser making is hard as hell, geez though, if this one guy can come up with a script that fixes nearly all of them, what is Microsoft's excuse. Not that I'd use this script as its an extra 11kb thats not really needed, still, for complex projects (or projects requiring IE5 compatibility - from what I'm reading it seems to make IE5 behave like a browser that passed grade 1 - thats too good to be true!) it could be really handy.
Excuse me but "arguing" for 11kb is a bit... uh... i don't know.. just a bit exaggerated. unless you are designing for old IBMs with 233mhz and 32mb ram Do note, this aren't things like "link building" and stuff like that, they are just tool like jquery, mootools and so on that helps the designer.
11kb for something is not needed at all (I can make IE work without this script) is big. Just like JQuery etc, it adds to the loading time. And who the hell is designing. If the designer has any say in the process, its usually because they are pixel-perfect freaks who will use a ton of images, a bucket of non-web fonts with spinklings of 24-bit transparency.
Sure, certainly you can make it work and that's be adding more lines in the CSS or code which will eventually increase the size of the file. loading time is something really vague to say, because it all depends on several things, how fast is the host, how fast the the connection of the user, how fast does apache delivers the request and how fast does the transfer complete (as in it gets affected depending where the users are) what i'm saying is that 11kb, 100kb is purely nothing and they will stay as nothing because browsers automatically cache these things. well, it's up to you anyway good luck fixing it in IE8!
Last time I checked, it didn't take 11kb's of CSS to make a site work in IE. Then again, maybe I don't code the way you do. More size = increased load time. No matter what. What about a 20kb site. Their load time has just been increased 33% for the sake of a few CSS declarations. Like I said, it has its place - for complex sites that require a variety of hacks for IE (to save throwing a heap in, just use the 1) or for working with IE5. For 95% of sites, it's an absolute waste. My 1 meta tag will ensure my sites work in IE8. Your script doesn't work properly in IE8, so you have fun fixing your sites in IE8!
Like I said before, HTML(static files)/Javascript/images/CSS gets cached (unless the script is dynamic of course, but those are just rare occasion). I guarantee you that javascript specially gets cached and you can go use internet explorer, put the js file in, go to the site, then in windows go to the temp folder and you'll see it there.(forgot the exact location) As for me fixing IE8 sites, I really won't even bother until the final is out. It's really a waste of time right now =/ I hope you didn't misunderstood my intentions, I just don't want people to burn their brains off when there are solutions out there.
Yes - but they have to load to start with. If the page screws around forever the visitor will hit back before its even done. Not everyone is on mega-super-turbo internet. Hell, my internet is fast, but its like dialup when I'm downloading something, and if I can tell a page isnt going to take ages I go straight back and pick another that has the exact same information. It seems stupid to run the risk of a site screwing up in IE8 when there is an extremely easy solution (then again, if you ask these guys, it costs $9 to add a meta tag as its SO difficult) No its fine, we got onto load-time etc. Being a minimalist, I stand by culling anything thats not necessary (which includes frameworks of any sorts). I'll use this script next time I have a project that requires IE5 compatibility: it could save time, fetching IE only stylesheets etc