The great Senator Jesse Helms and moral activist dies.

Besides the race issue what about the strong government values, Defending the 2nd amendment, anti-government spending, anti-welfare and wanting smaller government. Those are the qualities that promote a successful government.

 

He may have had his fine points in his eyes but did not fairly represent certain racial groups fairly. As many posts have already given comments of what he firmly believed in certain minority groups in the US. Especially of minority groups in which the state he represented held in slavery and he advocated racial slurs and tendancies towards them. Its appauling to say I would find this man moral.

Look everyone is anti something as a citizen in any government, many speak out while others remain silent. But it does not make him anymore special. It just goes against the grain of what Helms claims in trying to advocate. Hypocritical and the North Carolina stayed in tune with that wrongful attitude. A immoral decay I would say. And to say this is the type of man is a hero in your eyes and demonized in others. I would say you advocate his values political as well as back room comments I would say.

 

You have made some good points, very well written. I am not an advocate of his back room comments or racial slurs. If you look past his slurs and racism he promoted smaller government and less tax. The smaller government statement is what most Americans ask for. He voted no consistently against wasteful spending. That's “no vote” to waste is missing in DC today.

 

And this is the same crock that cannot see President Reagan was an expansionist president - he just spent it on a defense run to try and bankrupt the Soviet Union. Helms was goose-step on the same train. Or,

About says it right, in my consideration. Add to this his aforementioned contempt for democratic principles - his 1990 mailing campaign, discouraging black voters, intimating 125,000 people "might not be eligible to vote, and if they tried, they might be prosecuted for vote fraud," but one example from among a lifetime of sleeze; his blatant hypocrisies - say, taking a moral stand on "drugs" while being deeply in the pocket of Big Tobacco. And on and on.

You created this thread with "The great Senator and moral activist...." and Helms was neither.

 

WAS. Keep in mind, like a lot of segregationist supporters of the time, Helms was once a racist democrat. He became a Republican, and left that kind of hatred behind.

You can find that out via the link you posted.

 

Year of Helms's de-jure conversion to being a Republican: 1971.

The University of North Carolina was "the University of Negroes and Communists." - Capital Times, 1994.

Black civil rights activists were "Communists and sex perverts." - Copley News Service, 2001.

Sings "Dixie" in an elevator with Carol Mosely-Braun, with the now infamous line: "I'm going to make her cry. I'm going to sing Dixie until she cries." - 1993, Chicago Sun Times.

CNN, 1995; when a caller calls in to praise Helms "for everything you've done to help keep down the niggers," Helms's reply? To salute the camera and say, "Well, thank you, I think."

On and on, and this only takes account of his racism, not his latter-day hatred of homosexual Americans. Blinders and propaganda aside, Helms was a vile bigot to his dying breath.

 

^ Pot, meet kettle.


Have a really fantastic weekend!

 

Jeremy is now intimating I'm a vile bigot.

I realize that in Jeremy's mind, this amounts to a fantastic retort, but then fantasy seems to be something he's quite comfortable with - whether it's Helm's bigotry owing to his belonging to the Democratic Party (and ending, by a kind of partisan deus ex machina, on becoming Republican - dates and facts be damned), or his "certainty" that Barack Obama is an Islamic terrorist plant set to destroy the U.S. on assumption of the presidency.

I can appreciate a good and principled debate with intelligence and critical thought. Saying "nahnahnahnahnah" and sticking one's tongue out falls just a bit shy, in this respect.

 

NO, I'm just giving you a taste of your own medicine.

How's it feel?

Perhaps now you will grow up and stop harassing me on a daily basis. You've spent months attacking Guerilla and now have moved onto me for some strange reason.

Either go bug someone else, or leave like you promised to do so long ago. I think I speak for the vast majority here when we say we've had enough of the continual childish antics, race baiting and vicious attacks you've imposed on myself and others.

You are a sad excuse for a human being. Find a hobby or religion. Do something productive with your life instead of attacking people.

I'm asking nice. Leave me alone for a change.

 

Jeremy, calling me a bigot over my posting substantive information in reply to your nonsense post, that it was on becoming a Republican that Helms' abandoned his racism and bigotry - this is something you feel is a personal attack on you? And posting some nonsense about my being a bigot, this is somehow a reply to my points of substance on Helms's bigotry?

I am sorry you feel threatened, Jeremy, and that even on this thread you felt it necessary to report my posts to the mods (considering, I would guess, my use of "fantasy" as an infractionable offense, while giving a pass to your "poor excuse for a human being," etc.). Based on your previous rep abuse:

I understand you feel deeply bothered, seemingly, a sense of being deeply persecuted. I can't help that. If you post something I disagree with, I will likely post a reply, showing why, as I would with anyone with whom I disagree. If in response you are only left with what I would call childish tactics (rep abuse, or the above nonsense posting), again, I cannot help you with this, either.

As to the "vast majority," etc., I will have to leave you with this, as it's just an embarrassment to you. I do try to speak from considered points of substance, and am warmed by rep comments like:



I don't care to be agreed with; I do hope for a fruitful exchange based on good faith and clear thinking - it's how I learn.

As to calling me a poor excuse for a human being, I will also have to leave you with this personal attack, as it reflects very poorly on you as well.

 

Now he is shifting to the middle trying to get republicans Midwest voters.
I agree with you that Regan was a great President. He straightened out the train wreck that was the economy and won the cold war.

 

I'm not following you, Homebiz - "Now [he] is shifting to the middle ..." - are you referring to Obama? If so, agree - he is, as do all nominees, generally - but what does this have to do with this thread?

Other than that, I see two duplicate posts re: Regan [sic].

If you are referring to my earlier post on Reagan, yes, I would call him an expansionist, fiscally - he spent on guns, not butter. To call him a fiscal conservative isn't accurate in my opinion. It was under his stewardship that the federal budget deficit tripled in size: he cut taxes, while radically increasing public spending. Again, it may not have been spending on butter, but guns - but it was still spending what the government didn't have. This is not what I would call fiscal conservatism.

 

I did not intend to double post the computer froze.

 

You obviously did not read my post. You routinely skim my posts with blinders on.

I said nothing about racism, nor did I indicate an opinion about Helm's morality, prejudice, or whether I agreed or disagreed with the OP's subject line.

I said that Helm, while a democrat was a segregationlist. You need to read a bit more carefully, or at the very least stop reading your own version of reality into posts.

You've continually race baited people here, myself included. You've labeled people here at DP with terms like, racist, bigot, pedofile, among other things.

Do you really want me to start digging up out of context quotes from your posts? Personally, I do not believe it is necessary. You've had a pretty clear history of being a hateful person when someone disagrees with your opinion.

You really need to stop attacking people and learn to respect others ideas, opinions and positions.

What you got was a taste of your own sick, hate polluted ignorant medicine. I can see it struck a nerve, as it should.

Now that you know how it feels, perhaps you can learn to play a little nicer.

I don't feel threatened. I feel concern for your well being. Something has obviously happened to you recently. Something quite tragic to turn you into such a cold, vindictive hateful person. Death in the family? Wife left you? Dog got hit by a car? Lost your job? Who knows. Frankly, I don't care. What you need to do is turn that loss, whatever it is, into something positive and move on with your life.

If attacking me and others here makes you feel better about yourself, I'm happy to be of help. I just do not believe that is a very productive method of recovery. You should really seek another form of help, or at the very least find something else to release the stress and tension of you situation.

No, I am not bothered at all. Like I said, I am concerned about you. Just an FYI, I like to give red rep to people who complain about red rep. Keep complaining and I might just give you some.

Is that what bothers you? That people are giving you red rep? If you are getting a lot of negative rep, I can only assume it has to do with your recent hate filled posts.

Post something positive and helpful for a change and you might actually find people giving you positive rep. My suggestion? Get out of P/R once and while and contribute something useful.

Good Lord, we've turned from your misinterpretation of a post about the segregationalist background of Jesse Helms to you crying about rep.

Are you sure you are ok?

Like I said. When and if I deliver you some rep, I'll make sure to sign it like I always do!

Kinda hard to do when you do so with blinders on.

Poor choice of words, I apologize. I recognize you are a human being in need of some serious help.

 

Jeremy, I'm sorry if you're having trouble with what I would call some basic things. To take one example,

and

Now, could be me, "skimming posts with blinders on," but most folks tend to think "racism" and "segregationlism [sic]" are kinda like two peas in a pod. Guessing in your world, they're different?

Jeremy, your own words indicate your stand on things - I've added nothing.

As you know, I'm not alone - many people seem to have trouble with your views in this respect. Again, via PM, one example (and, again, much of it withheld, to protect privacy):



To my knowledge, I've called no one here a pedophile - do you wish to provide proof for your slander?

Sure - please do. If they are out of context, I will show how and why. If they are not, I will either stand by them, and say why, or apologize, if I was out of line. I don't have an issue with admitting my errors, when I commit them. I will not cry foul, and rest it on, well, crying foul.

My experience differs, and the balance of my rep, PM and board comments seems to say otherwise as well.

Well, I suppose, much like calling someone a nazi who isn't, calling me a bigot iis bothersome. Mostly, for what I would call its ridiculousness, to be honest. Like I said, equivalent to saying "nahnahnahnahnah" and sticking your tongue out, really.

Actually, no, I am only getting red rep from one source, apparently. Many people are kind enough to leave rep like:



-which is why I have a good rep, overall.

And again, the admin is able to see who is routinely going outside P&R to leave the red rep. Irksome, more than anything else, Jeremy, and it will be corrected soon enough.

The rest of your personal attacks I will have to leave as an echo.

 

I'm not taking sides here, I however am extremely confused.

You say you said nothing about racism, yet you try to claim he was a racist democrat, but once he became a republican he left that behind him.

 

Thanks, Grim, missed this on this latest round - I was tripped up by the notion of a "non-racist segregationist," but guess the above is a bit more of an obvious "wha?"

 

Thank you ! Well said. Helms was an Ass.

 

Yawn.. More of the same. Seems when I do not engage you in a debate you find others to attack. Maybe I'll ignore you for a while so you can get you jollys off with someone else.

Are you still whining about rep? Dude, start treating people with some respect and you might find people giving you positive rep. Its just that simple. That or stop whining about it. Its childish.

 

Jeremy - I'm sorry, but it sure seems to me that you embarrass yourself, and I would say your best bet is to just stay quiet on this - because with every post, you precisely illustrate my points, in my opinion. Unlike Guerilla, who at least has some skill, I find your ripostes lack even this. (If confused, please refer to posts 35, 36, for only the latest examples - any further finds re "non-racist segregationists," or "non-racist racist democrats?").