Why I think there are still poor people and people without medical care

Source? Sure, tons. Elsewhere:

http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showthread.php?t=772167&highlight=censorship&page=3

(Includes links to multiple instances of your support for censorship)

Here,

Kaethy's stated problem with corporations is their ability to put forth materials, because, well, they have the cash, while others don't:

Hence, a bit of a problem, as there are some, uh, loaded folks who can, and do, pay for time and space the less affluent cannot. Kaethy's stand demands censorship of all kinds of people and groups, and your support is further evidence for the hypocrisy inherent to your stated positions, respecting free speech.

Regarding whether I'll continue to "lecture" you or not, you're not important, though you would apparently like to be (although I have told you previously I do not wish to exchange PM's with you, you continue to send me PM's, so it's obvious you want attention). While you're not important, the right to free speech in our land is, and I will continue to post as I see fit, especially when I sniff horsemerde.

Have no idea what you mean when you say I am in support of state coercion to curb the freedom of association - you'll recall you're the John Birch Society Guy - the folks who brought you the Oscar-winning Drama, President Dwight D. Eisenhower, Traitorous Commie!, or, as its commonly known, GUILT by Association, baby!):

or, on the right to private property, I understand you support the era of Jim Crow segregation; however, as we have discussed, the constitution says otherwise. Since you dragged this in to this thread,

If you'd care to revisit your support for segregation and the constitutional problems with such a stance, the separation of Church and State in America, whatever; that's fine - perhaps we can refer back to the threads where these were discussed.

 

Where is the source in this thread? I've already told you you're full of crap for trying to tie a petition to censorship.

Is that all you have? Constantly rehashing attacks and misattributed positions from old threads? Is it because debunked got tired of your forum antics, and it looks like Kaethy might not have the stomach to put up with your relentless harassment?

This has nothing to do with me. Kaethy is != Guerilla.

Hypocrisy? You make up positions for me, then you harass me for months on the forum about them. And it's not just me, you single out others as well, then spend post after post stalking people on the forums, demanding to answer to positions that only exist in your head.

Let's talk about the hypocrisy of your horsemerde. You take shots at libertarianism, without even understanding the philosophy. You infer that I am a statist, when you are the one who believes that the state by majority vote can interfere with the right to free association and private property.

It's a big f**king joke that you would claim to champion free speech (see end).

You do lecture, because you're insecure and petty. Your purpose on this forum is to harass, harass, and harass some more.

Think about how many times you have thrown a fit and quit the forum. Remember your big "look at me" attention thread where you said you were leaving?

There is always some psychotic angle, where you lose control emotionally and go off on a tirade.

You've got problems bub. You should seek some help.

You don't believe in private property, you don't believe that people should be allowed the right of free association (which is reverse discrimination) but now you claim to be some champion of free speech. No one is buying it.

You are an outed hypocrite.

Btw, I really don't want to continue discuss with you, but I felt some guilt for how things went with us, and tried to make up/make amends so we could move past it. That was, up until this week when I see you harassing debunked and Kaethy and realize that it's not me. It's you. You're an A Class nutjob with emotional issues who projects the dissatisfaction with his life on everyone else.

 

Buddy, I don't want to waste the bandwidth reprinting the dozens of instances of your call for censorship. or your support for segregation, or your hypocrisies over what the Founders wanted with respect to religion and public life, or any of a host of other inconsistencies in your thoughts. It's why I provide links, rather than reposting, so that anyone with the desire to see what I'm talking about can look for themselves.

That said, I do speak my mind - and may even do it often. Given the sheer volume of posts and threads created by you in defense of your candidate, as well as your (at least named) positions, I would have thought you would understand that this is a public forum, and as such, I am free to post thoughts. We are unfortunately left with a situation, as usual, that when your errors are brought to light, it comes down to personal attacks, as a matter of course:

Or you will pander to emotionality out of one side of your mouth - I'm "hounding" "you, debunked, Kaethy", while having no issue with saying things like this:

You see, you were right. An issue I have taken up with debunked is precisely this issue. I don't consider it hounding - like yourself, I consider it a "response." Yet you would leap to pandering - to members, to issues, to emotionality, whatever works - whenever expedient, though I do think it is seen for what it regularly is.

Bottom line, I am more or less comfortable in my skin, though I do search out life for answers to questions that hold deep meaning to me; regarding this forum, I am quite comfortable with my integrity as a member here. It does hearten me to enjoy the regular esteem of many here, as well.

Guerilla, said in compassion whether you can muster the belief or not, it may help you to consider that when a significant part of the universe doesn't agree with you, it ain't necessarily the universe that needs serious reflection.

 

I am familiar with the theory of the lowest common denominator.

NPT, you don't have any integrity. You stalk and harass. You fabricate and conflate positions, you refuse to acknowledge clarification (in many cases, done exclusively to clear up your mis-perceptions), and you relentless hound people, quoting back thread, after thread, after thread.

The stunt with the PM you pulled with webbie I thought was just an indiscretion. But it's actually indicative of how obsessive you can become pursuing another poster, that you don't even see the error of betraying personal trust.

I'd like to say I am done with you, but you're obsessive and relentless. I'm sure you will try to stir more crap up again soon. The difference now is, I'm not going to play along or try to make up any more. You want the bull, you're gunna get the horns.

 

Guerilla, you will find I will continue to post in response to positions I don't agree with, particularly when those positions have the patina of dogmatic, though baseless fervor that yours tend to have, and as wrongly conceived as they are, by my consideration.

Turning to "relationship," I have several times asked you to not contact me via PM, and you continue to do it, thickly, as it seems to me. You are free to attempt your false methods, but you may not as a matter of course mount the kind of personal attacks as exhibited in the above posts.

As to "bull," "horns," etc. - I'm sorry to say I really am laughing. I saw the line too - watching Spongebob Squarepants with my son once, I believe it was. However, in terms of the real world, a web ranger with pretenses to prowess or valor doesn't exactly bring this member to quake in terror, philosophically, intellectually, corporeally.

 

I am going to ignore al the above stuff and just state my opinion here.

I do not care if people are without health care. Not my problem. Not the government's either.
Here is the thing.

Anybody can afford health care. If you work 40 hours a week at minimum wage you can afford health care and all other needed things to survive. Just cut back on stupid stuff like televisions and ipods and yo can survive.

But people are too lazy to actually do so.

 

You mean the positions you can twist and manipulate, right? The false attributions and conclusions you draw to attack and harass others, correct?

Baseless fervor? Like when you stalk debunked, or d16, or myself, or any number of others you have stalked on this forum?

Don't worry. Trying to be nice is gone now. You've left me with little doubt that you are a total jerk by your actions not just to me, but to others. It's all about NPT, his existential pseudo-intellectuallism. His moral superiority that allows him to interrogate and intimidate on a whim.

Personal attacks? I don't think addressing your behavior as what it is are personal attacks. You do harass. You are a jerk. You do betray trust, and flip between emotional highs and lows. I've seen guys like you on other forums before. Bi-polar nutcases who pretend to be friendly one moment, then abusive the next.

Some do it as a joke. Some do it for the attention. Some are truly messed up people.

What's the matter? Your Berkley education failing you? That saying is as old as the South. But then, I wouldn't expect you to understand that colloquialism when you twist and distort so many other plain and simple posts for your own self indulgent grandstanding.

I don't think you fully understood what I meant. You're not going to get a free ride to harass and stalk me on this forum anymore. I will point it out, and expose you for what you are every time.

At one point, I'm hoping it prompts you or one of your family members to get you some professional therapy.

 

There is no denying we are a consumerist country, and we make poor choices too often for the quick satiation over taking care of what matters.

But I can't agree that a person working 40 hours a week at minimum wage can afford health care in the United States. Many companies do not offer healthcare to its employees; many companies do so, but premiums are well beyond the ability for a given employee to pay; persons earning minimum wage cannot afford private insurance, nor can they afford out-of-pocket healthcare, without insurance.

Quick math - I'll go with the federal minimum wage, set to be $6.55 by July, '08 - yields, approximately, a net income of $850-$900 monthly. Out of this comes food, rent, clothing, etc. Notwithstanding catastrophes - massive illness, etc. - how would you squeeze your monthly income of $850 for healthcare, absent some kind of safety net?

 

It has been done on paper many times. You may not live in the greatest of all places but you can afford it all.

 

I won't waste breath and time repeating that the points in contention are available to all; anyone interested may look for themselves.

I will say that from what I can tell your true nature is showing itself. You may feel as you do, but you'd best find another means to deal with your frustration for having been confronted on the several inconsistencies I've addressed. You are not free to personally attack as you are now doing.

 

Minimum wage at 40 hours yields about $850-$900 per month. I'm asking sincerely - how would you propose one afford healthcare under such a scenario?

 

There are some plans that are only 150 isha month that still get you decent coverage.
Plus we have loads of free clinics anyways.

 

OK -

Scenario 1: $850-$150 = $700 for rent, food, transportation, "life"; in other words, impossible. Not to mention that there isn't a plan existing at that premium level that does not have either huge deductibles or other out-of-pocket expenses that would quickly tap the $700-net-premium earner.

Scenario 2: True, but these don't exist everywhere, and many of the illnesses affecting the seriously ill or injured are simply way beyond the scope of most, if not all, free clinics.

I don't see it.

 

Absolutely. I think your hypocrisy will come through loud and clear.

I'm not personally attacking you NPT. I truly believe you have emotional issues, which has led you to stalk and harass people on this forum for quite some time.

I really believe you need professional help. That you post in a bi-polar manner, and have a history of irrational post behavior.

Apparently, you've suddenly discovered the high ground and ability to hold your tongue, as I see the mods touring this thread, no doubt assessing your claims of personal attacks.

Which is fine by me. I'm sick of being challenged and harassed by you. I imagine others are as well. It's interesting to see how you are bold on the attack, but cowardly on the defense. I could even say, "enlightening".

 

I'm not sure what there is to "defend," Guerilla, since I won't respond to charges that I am psychotic, which obviously comes from my posts addressing your inconsistencies across several areas that are important to me, and should be important, I would think, to any of us: civil liberties, free speech, the separation of church and state, and so forth. If this is any help to you, four of the below come from your "friends":



You would do well to honor them by sticking to making credible points where possible, and addressing points raised in dispute with honorable debate. Resorting to calling me psychotic, or a nut job, and mentioning my family in this forum, is absolutely out of line.

 

Mentioning your family? You brought up your family first. I remember throwing it in my face that you weren't here because you were spending time with your kid or kids before. Don't bring up personal stuff on a public forum, and then cry that someone else is talking about it.

That exactly the sort of thing I am talking about. You intentionally twist points and arguments back on the other poster. You even fabricate positions (like my supposed support of censorship in this thread), or that I approve of censorship at all, and then proceed to attack my character, thread after thread.

I looked back at the # of times I apologized to you, even when I didn't think it was my fault for the sake of making peace. But it's pointless, because you're constantly baiting and attacking. To the point where I'm just the latest of many who no longer want to put up with your nonsense.

Anyone can go back through this thread, and see where you twisted my posts to kaethy into bait for you to get this argument going, where then you love to quote/link back to other fabricated arguments and false positions.

The difference between GTech and you, is that there is a playfulness to GTech and I going back and forth. I don't think either of us take it very seriously With you, it's malicious, constant etc. It's following me from thread to thread, it's making threads specifically to harass me, it's inventing interpretations of what I write and then spreading them to discredit me.

I stand by what I wrote. You're either here to intentionally harass, or you need mental help. Take your pick. I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that you can't control yourself.

 

You may continue to play games, as you are wont to do; or stop. These are your words, as they always are, and I twist nothing. Do not bring up my family in going to the gutter.

I will continue to post on substance on issues I care about.

I do not believe it is a stand for "liberty" to support censorship; I believe you strongly stand for censorship, and I have shown why, with details and facts;

I do not believe you can stand for the Founders' intent with respect to the separation of Church and State, citing to the Founders, and ignore the words of the Founders' themselves, which I have shown in detail;

I do not believe you can both voice your strong stand for the Constitution and support for the era of Jim Crow and legal segregation in the United States, all in the same breath; I have shown why, with details and facts.

These things matter to me. I give a damn about my country, and the people living in it. So I will continue to post as I see useful, and valuable. You may not as a matter of course resort to the above in trying to deal with your feelings stemming from my assertions counter to yours.

And, no, from what I know of Wade (Gtech), I don't think he considers you regularly calling him a fascist, etc., as a matter of course, "playful banter." In fact, though we disagree on most things politically, I think I can safely say that Gtech doesn't consider your methods "playful" at all.

 

Don't bring up your family when you are stalking and harassing me.

You will probably continue to conflate and manufacture false positions, while promoting the ones you have already promoted (as in this thread) to harass others.

There are no details and facts, because I don't support censorship. Remember, you're the one who reported me in this thread. You love that power of the state when you can flex it to promote your ideals, your positions, to cover your butt. These are evil and cowardly acts. Start a fight and run away.

Another mis-attribution and false position you have created to foster argument.

And more manufactured positions and lies.

I'm putting you back on ignore. My mistake has been reading the lies some posters here use to harass others.

 

I have zero idea what you're talking about re: my family, except that you have said:

Do not play games here. Do stop, immediately.

The rest of the crap is there for all to see, or:

"Free Speech":

"Founders' Intent on Church and State" - page 1, page 2

"Jim Crow and Constitutionality" - and the many following.

(NOT exhaustive, but helpful to anyone wanting to view for themselves - starting points only).

I do not say something on the web I wouldn't say to someone's face. Unlike some web rangers, who seem to feel secure casting brazen insults from their keyboard and the apparent comfort of mom and dad's study, what I say here I live in life. As a statement of principle, I think it works well enough.

 

I now fear for the Revolution due to infighting.

For shame...