Obama and the Muslim mystery

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by britishguy, Nov 14, 2007.

  1. debunked

    debunked Prominent Member

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    #261
    I really did think from some of your praise of the learning you have of socialism and your stance on social politics was nothing I read specifically. I haven't been reading this forum much lately, so sorry if I offended you, I really thought you were supportive of socialism.

    I have stox on ignore for obvious reasons, so I don't know what he says unless someone quotes him. His religious views drive him to be simply a jerk, if I could say so.
     
    debunked, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  2. Mia

    Mia R.I.P. STEVE JOBS

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    #262
    North, why do you keep mentioning Al-Qaeda? I don't recall saying anything about them.. I mentioned Hamas. It is well known that Obama's campaign has not only aligned itself with Hamas by way of it's future cabinet and advisor choices, nor is it a secret that they have funneled money through Move On by way of the great manipulator and architect of the Obama campaign Soros.
     
    Mia, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  3. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #263
    I'm not offended, debunked, you're just misinformed. Otherwise, to the above, not sure what you're talking about. If you could provide a specific example, we might be able to discuss something substantive. You did say, in so many words, that based on my statements on the forum, I am a socialist.

    Did you have something specific that led you to conclude this, or just kind of a "gut" thing?
     
    northpointaiki, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  4. bogart

    bogart Notable Member

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    #264
    It's really difficult to laugh off Obama's connection to Hamas. It was in vogue at many US universities to sympathize with Hamas and a number of college proffesors have been convicted for providing material support to a teerorist organization.
     
    bogart, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  5. msultani

    msultani Well-Known Member

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    #265
    To be honest with you guys, don't if you are voting for religion or a president.
    Because in religion or any religion lying is bad, but every president lies in one way or another. If you are or have the capabilities to be a good president and going to do good for your people, religion should not be the issue, because that is only personal belief.

     
    msultani, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  6. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #266
    Not sure where I got the idea some folks were trying to portray Senator Obama as a fundamentalist Islamist - any ideas, Jeremy?

    Please provide proof of this allegation, that Obama supports Hamas. "It is well known" needs to be made, well, as well known as the other "well knowns" of this charade.
     
    northpointaiki, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  7. bogart

    bogart Notable Member

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    #267
    Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. is his name.
     
    bogart, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  8. debunked

    debunked Prominent Member

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    #268
    Just reading your posts led me to believe you favored socialism. I didn't go look for it but the last one I read was referring to your schooling and it seemed to have mention of socialism in other posts in that thread. Like I said, I didn't read a post that specific to your stance, just an overall feel I got.

    Do you like certain aspects of socialism or would you say the whole package of pure socialism would be bad for our country?

    From what I know of socialism, I don't want it. We have swayed enough to socialism to see that it just doesn't work. Welfare doesn't help people in the state run form. We all know what happens when you let the state run anything - large amounts of waste.
     
    debunked, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  9. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #269
    I believe that in this thread my mention of socialism contested Guerilla's accusation by reference to what socialism actually is - a common ownership of the means of production in a given political economy. I also referred to social security - an example of Guerilla's "socialist state" - and how it was established, in the west, by Otto von Bismarck, Prussian, Junker (that's Aristocrat), Authoritarian prime minister under Kaiser Wilhelm II, head of the coalition of Iron and Rye, and enemy to socialism. In other words, modern society - not socialism.

    I'd ask you to take a look at the various threads and discussions on "user fees" over taxes, what it means to be in society v. the state of nature, etc. Sorry, debunked, but I've covered this many, many times. You may have a "feeling," but I don't wish to go over old territory unless you truly want to make an appraisal based on what has or hasn't actually been said.
     
    northpointaiki, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  10. humanedited

    humanedited Peon

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    #270
    Is it actually a law for American citizens to place their hand over their heart during the anthem? Is it just in specific situations or anytime the anthem is played?


     
    humanedited, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  11. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #271
    Yep, it is, from what I can tell. Most (including the Prez, apparently) don't know it.
     
    northpointaiki, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  12. lightless

    lightless Notable Member

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    #272
    I pity handicapped people with no hands. They will never be true Americans.
     
    lightless, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  13. maldives

    maldives Prominent Member

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    #273
    He is something and I am sure you know it by now.

    Nice conclusion... :rolleyes:

    Oprah is a supporter and of course she was trying to assist him. ;)
     
    maldives, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  14. debunked

    debunked Prominent Member

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    #274
    That is fine. I am sorry if I misunderstood your standing from what I had read. Like I said I haven't been here that much lately. I didn't mean to create a frustration for you. I still enjoy learning from you even if we don't agree. I just made an error in judgement assuming. But I will try to make some time to read your posts to see if I can grasp more of your view. I shouldn't have said anything to begin with since you have been very touchy in these subjects lately. I do understand your frustration in a couple of threads, but sometimes you just need to let people ramble on and not "feed the trolls"
     
    debunked, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  15. davewashere

    davewashere Active Member

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    #275
    It's customary to stand up with feet together, remove caps/hats, and face the flag. It is in no way a law, although you'd have a hard time getting elected president if you didn't honor the traditional customs. It is not the custom to place a hand over the heart during the national anthem, just the Pledge of Allegiance. Some people choose to place their hand over their heart, but this is not the way I was taught in elementary school (it's seems to have become popular in recent years, possibly as a result of politicians trying to "one-up" each other in displays of patriotism). Singing along is encouraged during the national anthem, and I find it funny that Obama was the only person who actually appeared to be singing - perhaps everyone else just forgot the words.
     
    davewashere, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  16. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #276
    Debunked, I am not frustrated, and please don't construe this as "touchy," which is veiled, and very weak, in my mind. While it might be easier to jump on whatever latent bandwagon has developed that way, you called me a socialist on admittedly no evidence, and as we are discussing the candidacy of someone likely to become the next President of the U.S., I will address points as they come up - presumably, something we all do in the forum. In this thread, Guerilla jumped aboard the usual blather on "Obama the ________" (name your smear), and it required addressing.

    To be honest, because you didn't have any facts in place, I consider your actions here just a bit of feeding the troll, buddy. I'd recommend you read what's here - and forego the attempt to mindread as to my subterranean "intents" behind supporting Sen. Obama.;)
     
    northpointaiki, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  17. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #277
    Agreed. Well said.
     
    northpointaiki, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  18. guerilla

    guerilla Notable Member

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    #278
    You might get that impression because I am adamantly anti-socialist, and NPT has been stalking me on the forum for over a month due to comments I made about the JBS.

    However, on Feb 23rd, NPT and I sorta agreed to put each other on ignore after being admonished by another forum member for arguing, after which I see he has attacked me through Rebecca, and now you, and I can only assume that in his posts I am ignoring, he has been continuing to attack me.

    I'm new to having an estranged stalker, despite numerous years spent posting 10s of thousands of posts on forums.

    So forgive me if I won't comment on whether or not he is a socialist.

    Paul, if you're reading this, and I hope you are, please take a break. It ain't healthy relentlessly hounding someone online, a person who wants no part in communicating with you.

    You've posted to me or about me at least 9 times in the last 3 days, over 3 threads, while we were supposedly going to "avoid aggravation".

    Really man, it's time to chill out. You're scaring me.
     
    guerilla, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  19. Zibblu

    Zibblu Guest

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    #279
    The ridiculousness in this thread just continues. It's baffling to me. It really is. I don't see any point in trying to correct the "logic" of some of the more misguided posts because it's clear that the people that are making these posts are either trolls or insane. Or both, of course.

    BTW, Obama haters - His campaign surpassed ONE MILLION donors today. I wonder how many donors McCain has?

    I don't think Obama is perfect, I wish he were stronger on some issues for sure. But I do think he's an impressive politician and a great speaker. And I think he's much better on some of the big issues than John McCain is.

    The issues I wish he were stronger on, for the most part, are not issues he can not be stronger on and remain "mainstream" so I understand that politically he may be hedging a bit to appear more "centrist." I hope he's more of a civil libertarian & pacifist than he lets on with some of his rhetoric. That's my hope ;) Spring it on us after you get elected big O! Funnily enough, I am imagining that this same hope of mine is some others fear.

    I'd also say that I totally respect people who dislike Obama because of his politics (being too liberal... not being liberal enough, whatever your perspective)... It's the ridiculous name calling and absolutely STUPID conspiracy theories that make me shake my head in disbelief.
     
    Zibblu, Feb 27, 2008 IP
  20. northpointaiki

    northpointaiki Guest

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    #280
    Uh, Guerilla - you will recall you entered the thread to name Obama a socialist, and you then whined when you received a response. That you cannot handle a response, afraid I can't help you with that. And no, you're not really attempting your usual tactic here - not dissembling, or anything like that:

    Debunked answers your post, naming me a socialist. He admits he has no basis in fact, just a "hunch." I responded to Debunked, and gave a factual basis for my response. You preach liberty, call anyone who doesn't support your ill-informed view of "user fees" a socialist, and you are a John Birch Society supporter. That dog don't hunt, Guerilla, as should be plainly evident to any reasonable mind. I call it a "posting of fact"; you call it an "attack."

    And while your hanky-wringing here may sway some folks - and it very well may, much to my surprise - I truly don't give a damn. You certainly took no issue with diligently pursuing your agenda when it was your candidate who at least had some semblance of saliency on the forum, and now that you simply cannot answer for the flaws inherent to your views, please don't expect the rest of the world to move to a standstill.

    While your "defending liberty":

    I'm taking my perspective as a veteran, a father, and someone with a deep sense of hope for a brighter tomorrow - to support this candidate, with facts as to why.

    I will also respond as I see fit, to counter arguments based on misstruths, smears, conspiracy nonsense. I understand your position on the freedom of expression is a bit dodgy, at best, but if responding to a post you've made rocks your world, I'd suggest you don't post.
     
    northpointaiki, Feb 27, 2008 IP