American Student goes to Palestine to help only to find out the truth

So innocents killed by jihadists are expendable cattle??????????

 

Well ... an innocent women or child killed by jihad or murdered is dead either way.

What's the difference?

Both Jihad and murder are bad

 

correct i agree

 

When you kill people for allah it is soo much better! Did you read the post from Grab, "Adultery isn't "screwing around", it is having sex with another person while married, it ruins lives. Usually more than one, so it's best to get to the root of the problem. I don't agree with stoning but capital punishment should be done in the least painful way."
So he believes in killing people for adultery, but proposes to kill them in a nice way. Religion of peace.

 

Is a nice way a bomb? You don't see it coming and you sometimes go fast.

 

Death is death whatever that method is.

 

I see you made it back, but curiously you have avoided the questions put to you.

Something like that.

 

Buddy, I am an Indian. I had to sleep here, while you were awake in US.

Good Morning...

Please tell me what you want to know.

Grab my heat believed historical context is not necessary. But I think otherwise. In Islam, you just cannot kill people, whether Muslim or non-Muslim. It is forbidden under the rules of Warfare that Prophet had laid down.

Rules of Warfare in Islam: http://en.allexperts.com/q/Islam-947/warfare-islam-1.htm

Christians and Jews are to be respected as "People of the Books", because according to the Quran, Jewish Torah and Christian Bible also came from God, and also declares that God has sent Prophets to earth from time to time in order to guide men. 24 prophets are mentioned, including Adam, Abraham, Issac Ishmael, Moses, David, Solomon, Jesus Christ....

That is why, Islam has mutual respect for all religions.
And the hadiths which are being quoted about killing apostates and all that should be read in context. Otherwise the entire meaning gets distorted.

 

Hahhah - sleep? How dare you when matters of such import are at hand! Well, judging from Grab's itchy finger - I think he got nervous when there wasn't an answer in about 10 minutes - I suppose a night's sleep is a more reasonable request.

OK, it appears you and Grab have differing opinions. Grab appears to indicate it is heresy to do anything other than kill adulterers and apostates, in fulfillment of Hadith. You say otherwise; you therefore say the Qu'ran, Hadith, Sharia are not to be taken literally, word for word. Is that correct?

As an aside - please don't take this as anything other than the fact I am sincerely curious - but can you tell me, what is it like to be Muslim, in India? Of course, if this is too personal, I do not mean to offend, and feel free to tell me to mind my own business; but I am curious about life as an Indian Muslim, as I would think this is a fairly unique experience.

 

The Quran, or hadith should be read in context for complete understanding. Just ripping off some parts of it would distort the meaning.

Suppose a judge in California awards capital punishment to a convict. If you ignore the underlying REASONS for his, then you'd infer there is no difference between a murderer and a judge, isn't it?

In the same way, historical context and the background conditions in which that verse was told would determine the actual meaning.

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India is a beautiful country. All Muslims here are completely integrated in the society. The culture of all people in India, may it be Hindus, Muslims, Christians, Buddhists or Sikhs is the same. That really helps in avoiding friction.

Even though it is a Hindu majority country, Muslims have considerable religious freedom. Temples and Mosques co-exist side-by-side.

People here are good. The country has hundreds of languages, and this makes India truely unique. Muslims and Hindus respect each others religions, customs and traditions. And there is very little bias. Overall, a great place to live in...

 

Thank you for the reply, Gauharjk. I will speak very personally. It is difficult for me, a non-Muslim, to know what most Muslims think with respect to their faith and some of the things many of us, if I can be so bold as to speak for non-Muslims, find troubling.

Both you and Grab have said that groups like Al-Qaeda are heretics and murderers, having nothing to do with your faith. I respect this and embrace your view. But then, there are people being stoned, hung, shot - in today's day and age - by putative reliance on a literal embracing of Hadith and Sharia. Grab has said there is no context - all is to be taken literally, including the killing of these apostates and adulterers, today. At the same time, he claims to be representative of "orthodox," and not "militant," Islam. So I wouldn't be truthful if I didn't find myself wondering - what do most Muslims really believe? Here, on this board alone, we have had wildly divergent opinions - the two of you but two. Menj1980, formerly banned (I think he's back - not sure), was in much the same line as Grab.

I care because I do seek a bridge of understanding. But I cannot embrace those who for whatever reason - faith, creed, personal sickness - would murder men, women and children over things such as the choice to relinquish their faith, to love members of the same sex, or to engage in adultery.

Anyway, thank you for the reply. Thank you also for your perspective on life in India. It sounds beautiful. I have many Indian friends, but most of them come from either the Hindu or Sikh communities. I have never met an Indian Muslim, and I am grateful to you for your perspective. Peace.

 

I can say the same thing on arabs.

If the region would live in peace and harmony without Israel then what do you say for the land claims that Iraq has on Kuwait and Iran and vice versa?
These claims have lead to war

Give the land back to who? Palestine is not a country, never has been and probably never will be. After all the Palestinians had numerous chances to declare independence and chose not to.

Palestinian terrorists have stated many times that they will not stop the rockets until Israel is wiped off the map so no, they will not stop.

Palestinian terrorism is to blame as are those that support them.

 

Ya... I agree. Thank God Sadman was defeated. Now, finally we can look forward to democracy in Iraq as well...

I agree with this one as well. That is why, my friend, you'll be hearing a lot about One State solution from now on. In case you don't know about it, please allow me to explain.

- The historic land of Palestine belongs to all who live in it and to those who were expelled or exiled from it since 1948, regardless of religion, ethnicity, national origin or current citizenship status;

- Any system of government must be founded on the principle of equality in civil, political, social and cultural rights for all citizens. Power must be exercised with rigorous impartiality on behalf of all people in the diversity of their identities;

- There must be just redress for the devastating effects of decades of Zionist colonization in the pre- and post-state period, including the abrogation of all laws, and ending all policies, practices and systems of military and civil control that oppress and discriminate on the basis of ethnicity, religion or national origin;

- The recognition of the diverse character of the society, encompassing distinct religious, linguistic and cultural traditions, and national experiences;

- The creation of a non-sectarian state that does not privilege the rights of one ethnic or religious group over another and that respects the separation of state from all organized religion;

- The implementation of the Right of Return for Palestinian refugees in accordance with UN Resolution 194 is a fundamental requirement for justice, and a benchmark of the respect for equality.

- The creation of a transparent and nondiscriminatory immigration policy;

- The recognition of the historic connections between the diverse communities inside the new, democratic state and their respective fellow communities outside;

- In articulating the specific contours of such a solution, those who have been historically excluded from decision-making -- especially the Palestinian Diaspora and its refugees, and Palestinians inside Israel -- must play a central role;

- The establishment of legal and institutional frameworks for justice and reconciliation.

I recommend we call that new country - Greater Israel. What do you say?

I know, this is the only way left now.

 

I saw a post here of someone that thinks we should make Jerusalem international city - I agree with that.
In my opnion jerusalem belongs to Jews, Muslims and Christians.

 

I agree with you...

Jerusalem is the Holy City of Muslims, Christians as well as Jews... We should bury our differences, and have some peace.

Why has the Holy Land soaked in blood of faithful for thousands of years?

Does this land ask blood? I believe there has been more blood spilled for this piece of land than anywhere else in the world...

 

No my friend, it is not like that. Allow me to explain... In Islam, killing a man is forbidden. There are stringent Rules of Warfare. You cannot go and randomly kill anybody.

You are not allowed to kill non-combatants.

Source: http://islambyquestions.net/jihad/war.htm
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@northpointaiki

There are people in Muslim countries who are very orthodox, and don't believe in studying the context in which a decision was made.

IMO, it would be unwise to believe any decisions taken, or laws formulated 1400 years ago were done randomly,without any context or reason. There definitely were reasons for it, and those reasons, and prevailing conditions should be studied as well if we really wish to interpret the laws.

Otherwise, it would seem so demonizing. People hear on radio and tabloids, how Muslims "chop off hands, stone women to death" and other crappy stuff.

But these are rare instances There still are ignorants ruling countries like Saudi Arabia, and such people don't understand the true Commands of God, or the Laws of Sharia.

 

Thank you, Gauharjk. I do appreciate the reply. Hopefully we can all look forward to a world where all of us find a way to live in mutual respect and peace.

Paul

 

That doesn't appear to be historically or scripturally accurate.

Take a quick read through Prophet of Terror and the Religion of Peace--Part I for a good healthy debunking of that notion.

But us Atheists, we're animals who should be slaughtered.

 

You base that opinion from an anti mulism progerganda website?

I thought you had more sense than that Will but there again it doesnt surprise me.

 

Do you have anything to say to contradict the facts posted on that page?