No, I don't believe it is common. And I'll ask again, and this time please try to answer truthfully. Please provide a single instance when I indicated it is common. Beyond that, please provide a single instance when I was talking about anyone's beliefs in this way but my own. Remember - Jesus instructed us all to look into our hearts and have the courage to answer truthfully as to what's there.
Well explain to me your shock in the fact that i didnt understand your admiration on Jesus. you are not hurting me, in fact, i feel for you
You never specifically said it was common, but your reactions and replies insinuated that it was, and that i was stupid for not seeing it also. Again its contextual, seems like so many unbelievers have problems with context
SB, I already said this. If my saying "I," "this is my journey," etc. leads you to assume some kind of declaration of this being common, that is your problem, to put it bluntly. Maybe this will help make it clearer. I try not to judge others. I honestly accept Christ's dictum that I have enough to work on myself before spending my time judging everyone else. Thus, I freely acknowledge that my atheism itself is a declaration of faith, really, since none of us can know by our senses, though I have come to my conclusions based on what I have learned so far. One of the reasons I came down on Stox, who didn't see that we are, all of us, taking a leap of faith. Hence, I do not judge you for your faith, though I disagree with your conclusions regarding this thread, namely, speciation, etc. That said, if you take the tack that I am merely some loon beclouded with illogic because I happen to have a belief that differs from yours - and, beyond, fail to move past lazyness in not seeing how someone who doesn't believe in the divine can still find much to admire in the man, Christ, and his ethos, then I object. Does that help? (Sincerely - no sarcasm in place).
I have no problem with what you believe, you are welcome to it. Since our little discussion started here, you have ragged on me because i didn't notice sarcasm, yet you do not notice obvious figurative speaking in the bible . you have called me limited, yet you accept only your own conclusions. You have basically laughed in my face, because i was surprised that an atheist could admire Jesus, yet i find it to be a rare situation, among most atheist, therefore validating my surprise. Then you deny you even insinuated such a thing. Then you post remarks from the web that does support it. My point is this. Your comments are one contradiction after another, i do not think i will trust your logic, because it seems very inconsistent. That being said. God Bless You
Sigh. Brother. But you have insisted I have stated all along this is a common thing. When asked for proof I have said this, you couldn't provide any. Now, you are saying I am essentially a bucket of contradictions. Please provide a single contradiction I've made. Then, please help me to understand how: -Isn't contradictory. And since this issue - "literally, across the board," or "at least some symbolism, which introduces the idea of interpretation" - is central to our discussion, it's not inconsequential that your apparent conflicting statements impact on the subject at hand. I do wish you well, as well. If you feel I have laughed in your face, I am sorry for that. I do not intend on belittling you. I do object to you calling into question my life and what I believe, without anything other than baseless comments.
US? Athiests? Is this in inclusion of others with your thoughts? As far as my contridiction, put them in context read the complete thread, do i believe the bible is 100% literal? No. And the context of this thread will tell you that. Context is important, if i had read the context of mia's thread, i would have known she was on my side, if i had read the context of your previous post i would know you were confused.
SB. We are on a thread inside a forum. Might "us" not be the folks on this forum? I will answer, this was what I meant by "us," not "us atheists." I'm sorry you missed this as well. To your second paragraph, I don't know how else to say it. A guy said everything shouldn't be taken literally. You said, yes it should, or else you leave room for interpretation. Then you said, no, not everything should, that there are instances where interpretation and figurative language have a hand. It is categorically a contradiction, at least to me.
For your top statement, fine, i will leave it at that. But please do not make it sound like it was completely obvious what you meant, because it wasn't. this statement is enough to insinuate the relationship between atheism and Jesus as "basic" in your eyes. But i will take it as a misunderstanding. As for my statement about the bible being literal, you are correct, it is a contradiction, but only because i wasn't perfectly clear in that sentence. Again read the complete thread, not just bits and pieces, and you will know my views well.
SB, I hope this helps. I was saying that as it seemed you had trouble with "basics," something as uncommon as an atheist who admires some things about Christ, which would require a certain sublety of thought or acceptance of a broader sensibility, would seem to me even more difficult for you to accept. I am sorry you missed this point as well. I have read the thread, and spent far too much time on it. I asked you more than once to show me a single instance of my casting some wide net of this notion as a "common thing," and you couldn't provide one. I have asked you more than once to provide a single instance of contradiction in my statements, and you have not provided one. I provide you with your own contradictory statement, and you assign "context" as an excuse. My friend, there is no context to the word "everything." Everything is literal, or it is not. You stated everything is to be taken literally, then stated not everything is literal. And it is in this that the very thrust of the debate matters. Anyway, I've said all that can be said from my perspective. All the best in believing what you believe.
I have posted two instances of your contradictory, you have written them off, I'm not going to play your childish game. If i was wrong, then i accept that. And i admitted to my mistake unlike you, after all I am not perfect, and never will be. But context matters no matter what you are reading, without context a meaning can be skewed to whatever the reader wants. Granted i said one statement, that contradicts my belief, but only because when i first replied to that statement, i overlooked the "everything" part. Are you so blind you cant see what i believe by reading this thread. Let me clarify. I believe the bible should be taken as literal as possible, if a statement is questionable the context should be looked at closer. if it is still unclear it should not be practiced, or taught.
Sorry, I am not playing games, I am sincerely asking - I must have missed it. Where was I contradictory? And where are the "two instances" when you pointed it out? To your second part, I'll accept this is your view. But we have what I have said is a problem from the beginning. It is 100% literal, or it is not. Once you introducing subjectivity into the equation - "if a statement is questionable" -you have tossed out objective truths by definition. So, your day might be a literal 24 hours, to another, eons of time, in "God time." "breath through the nostril" might be a gift of life - such as symbolically represented by the Sistine Chapel: Or it is your literal breath of God in Adam's nose. The problem is that once subjectivity enters into the equation, all of you have the same standing, so judging another's viewpoint as to what is literal and what figurative is flawed.
one is post 802, but as i said, you wrote it off to mean something else, the other is on the previous page where in one post you claim never said it was common(for athiest to respect Jesus) and that you didnt believe it was, and in the next post you post a link from the web that shows others that feel the way you do. So though you say you are not claiming it to be common, you post a thread that would state otherwise, that brother, is contradictory, but go ahead and explain that one right under the rug
???? post 802 is from deathshadow. A bit flustered? As to your "second" proof, <<sigh>>. Brother, I will definitely let you in on when I am being ironic from now on. Line "two" above was a pun on my statement, which is, and I quote, that it is unique (and not a common thing) at all. Words like "groundswell" off of my little opinion and a lame website should tip one off to "irony." But since you still seemed confused, I made it explicit with: So are you or are you not saying it is common for atheist to respect and admire Jesus. Because one minute your saying it is, the next, your saying you never said such a thing, yet you still call me the confused one -And thus we keep going over old territory. It doesn't get any better simply repeating. And since I am an atheist, and I believe in the here and now, and my wife is about to strangle me for arguing uselessly on this esteemed forum, I'll have to bid you adieu.
Northpoint, we are both arguing the impossible, and though no result is the end result, i must say i enjoyed it. We can call it finished for now. But it will be back sooner or later. I understand you views, my only point was that they were not as black and white as you made them out to be. I'm glad as an atheist you do admire Jesus. I'm sorry you feel the way you do about God. But i can testify, as can millions. He does exists, and you have two choices, and one is harsh, but you can cry out to the lord, so that perhaps he will grant you a change in mind, and save you from the devils snare, or you can do nothing, die and burn in hell. If you once believed, truly believed, then there is probably still a chance for you. No pressure, i just want you to know i see some good in you. I see some faith in you as well. Greetings and Salutations to the Mrs. I apologize for irritating your husband. God Bless. By the way, why do you call me brother?
Thanks, SB. I appreciate that you are sincere in your beliefs and I can always honor that. I call you brother because this is how I want to view all of mankind. I have seen enough of hate, and I hope for a world at peace. Knowing my own shortcomings, and my own ego, calling you brother, calling anyone brother or sister, is a reminder to me that we are, all of us, in this human condition.
science has facts to back up most of its claims, unlike the bible which is all basically heresay. The people who believe in the bible want to play the science game and say they have facts for their beliefs... where is it?