Russia Has No Permanent Enemies Only Permanent Interests

The recent spat between the US and Russia over the proposed deployment of missile systems in Poland and the Czech Republic does not indicate a revival of the cold war.
Despite the implosion of the Soviet Empire, Russia like the US has legitimate interests. It regards countries on its borders as its sphere of influence. Any encroachment by the US and NATO on the so-called near-abroad will be regarded by the Russians as a hostile act.Have we forgotten that President Kennedy forced the former Soviet Union to remove the missiles that it had installed on Cuba?Why ? The sheer presence of the missiles only 90 miles from Florida had tilted the balance of power in favour of the Soviets and the US wasn't going to submit to nuclear blackmail.So the US was even prepared to wage a nuclear war when its security was threatened. How could the Russians turn a blind eye when missiles are targeted at it?Flushed with cash from oil and gas revenues,they are again reasserting themselves and will not allow themselves to be pushed around by the US or its European allies

 

I believe the czechs were only getting a radar station, no missiles (missile launches would be from poland). that he could accept. Not that it really matters what he thinks; if the czechs want the station, I'm sure they'll get it.

If Russia doesn't want missile defense next to it, maybe it should stop developing new nuclear weapons. Just a thought.

 

The Soviets put nuke missiles in Cuba in response to US nuke missiles in Turkey. "....but American missiles located in Turkey could strike almost anywhere in the Soviet Union. Khrushchev feared that the imbalance would tempt the U.S. to launch a first strike....."
http://www.u-s-history.com/pages/h1736.html

The Soviets removed them from Cuba after US agreed to remove theirs from Turkey. ..............Privately it was agreed that the Jupiter missiles positioned in Turkey would be withdrawn in a few months, but that the decision would not be publicly tied to the agreement about Cuba..............http://www.u-s-history.com/pages/h1736.html


US installed first theirs in Turkey. The Soviets only kept the balance..

This is how most people in US think. .... We are right all the time. We never did anything wrong to anybody. ..

I wonder how this admin would like it if Russia installs such a system in Cuba.

 

should read:

Russia Has No Permanent friends, Only Permanent mistrust

 

Yeah, because that's what america done when Russia had missiles in cuba... Oh, wait.

 

Ah, but you see there you miss the obvious counterpoint (or don't care to be honest about this). No one is parking nuclear missiles just off their border, pointed at them during a cold war. We are putting in a radar station, nothing more. Are you claiming the two are roughly equivolant?

 

I'm saying it's more than roughly equivalent. I'm saying it practically has the same repercussions in a war. The ability to defend against missiles is as good as the ability to fire them.

It's a fact that missiles would have to be pointed at the countries hosting these stations. What are Russia supposed to do? Not take any action against something that could eventually cause the complete destruction of their country in a war? get real you joker.

 

it's clear you aren't taking a realistic view of this, and are just trumping up on something you don't even understand.

the missiles are based in poland for an attack on europe. the radar station is an early warning system to get the inbound missile something to target to. the radar isn't linked with something that could "cause the complete destruction of their country" in a war. I'm not even sure if you know what is being talked about here.

your opinion, in essence, seems to be that no other country near russia can have a radar based inside its borders, lest russia get mad about it?

and, fyi, russia already blinked here. they've already given places that would be acceptable hosts for the radar base that are being looked at. so, clearly, their view isn't nearly as dire as yours.

 

I'm saying other countries should definitely be allowed missile detection systems, But their own. America shouldn't be allowed to position things around another country, And if they do, They should expect countries to make it perfectly clear that there may come a time when their stuff is going to get blown up.

But if you think these missile detection systems are simply going to be used to detect missiles you are far more simple than i gave you credit for. What do you think they are going to do once they detect a missile? Just look at it?

 

So you don't think this czechoslovakia or any other country should be able to come to the US and say, "hey, we'd like to install your radar here" just in case someone else gets mad about it. And if it is installed, that gives some other country full rights to start blowing shit up.

Did I say that it'd just be stared at? Poland hosts the missiles that shoot down the incoming missiles. I am hoping you are clever enough to think about things a little. Should I explain things to you each time I post?

 

It doesn't work like that and you know it. The countries that install Americas war hardware do so for economical and political reasons, Not because they would "like to".

Yes, It does. America have even go so far as to say they may destroy the satellites used for the European GPS if they suspect they are being used by people who america doesn't want to use it.

See, What you have to understand is you aren't the only country on the planet. Do me a favour. Every time you manage to muster and opinion on global politics think to yourself "How would i feel if they done this to us" and then post your reply.

People are sick of America saying what they want and then expecting to get it every time.

Well guess what? Russia don't want their missiles shot down. Understandable, Isn't it?

 

Everyone has motivations. I do not see your point?

Yes I understand you believe this. You've said it multiple times. Don't project. You are the only one pitching a fit here. Russia has already suggested alternative locations. They've also been offered to join onto the missile defense as well. You are upset about nothing.

So, again, if I understand your view here. You think it's fine and dandy for Russia to lob missiles on people. Is this what you are saying here? I am not sure, again, if you even understand the issue here.

You are acting silly here, again. Any more hyperbole you'd like to throw out to make yourself look silly?

 

Actually my opinion has little to do with Russia and a lot to do with americas foreign policy and their childish need to get what they want at the expense of others, All the time.

They have as much right to as anyone else. Should they destroy american hardware for the sake of national security? Of course.

 

and again......Russia offered that, not US.

You are talking about Poland & Chezh Rep like if they were thousand miles away from each other. Do you know how close they are located? It would make no difference if these missiles were going to be placed in : Hungary, Kosovo, etc.

As I see it, the problem is not where they are going to be placed. The problem is that US broke the agreement of not placing these things in Europe, so that clearly means "We do not respect you and can do whatever we want", what else do you expect to do from Russia, defend itself is the only response.

 

http://usinfo.state.gov/xarchives/d...&m=June&x=20070604181402dmslahrellek0.2784693

I've read this exact same thing on many different sites. US offered. Not Russia. Russia doesn't want to join. Anything to the contrary on this?

I know where they are located. That is not the point, is it? Poland is hosting the missiles. Czech is hosting the radar. Russia isn't really raising a fuss about the missiles in Poland, as far as I know.

Russia is fine to advocate its position. Russia has also suggested alternative locations for the radar sites. So they don't care -really- quite as much as a few people in this forum do. Russia just wants to play bad cop here, as it does with everyone else.

 

This is like a talk between a chess master and a novice. You keep telling them this is a wrong move you gonna lose a piece and they refuse to accept it.
Americans are so easy to manipulate, they even eleceted Bush twice.
Because he told them what they wanted to hear "We are the greatest country in the world. We have the strongest army in the world. We'll defeat the terrorists."

 

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,487841,00.html

I saw it on TV when they spoke together, I think we are talking about different things, I am saying that Putin offered his base and work together.

You are probably talking about polish base? That wasnt in US plans anyway to work with Russia on it.

 

Nope. I'm talking about the radar stations. Bush offered Russia to work together on it. That's the link I posted earlier. Putin turned him down, this may have been his counter-proposal, I have no idea. I read this story a few weeks ago too, but nothing came of this, as far as I know.

Either way, this is hardly the "end of the world" situation some of the people in this thread have brought up. Putin ended up looking very silly at the end, threatening to point missiles at Europe (as if they aren't - harkening back to the USSR days). He really came off looking bad here, and I think that led to bad negotiations with a few EU people after the fact too.

 

I dunno, probably in US they say Bush offered, but I heard on TV their meeting, and Putin offered it, if that base is Russian, then logically only Putin could offer to work on it together.

Putin did not threaten Europe, what he said is:

Our weapons arent on European part of Russia, he just will bring it on European part as US plans to do it. There is more Russia vs US, then vs Europe, Europe are friends, that's what US do not want to happen.

 

As far as I know, the two nations agreed to stop producing Nukes. Whether radars go up or not, if you are making nukes, you are going against that agreement. Stop making nukes. And I think that if a nation is going to make nukes or even HAS nukes, radars should be put up to ensure that there is awareness of these weapons so that the countries can defend against them.