facts are relative we have to win this war. we have to think with our head not our heart. we have to have strategy and ideas not slogans
i think we all agree that w have to stop fanatic islam and terrorists but we have a disagreement on how and exactly who
I see you still haven't got it have you? Let me make it clearer; I was NOT trying to steer clear of the actual issues and was NOT making the messengers the issue. The translated verses that you pointed out whic apparently reffered to Jews and Christians as apes looks like it has been written by a 5 year old, 'this might be referring to jews'-Do you class that as concrete evidance?. There is no direct referance in the Quran e.g Jews and Christians are apes and pigs. There is no denial about this, if its not there, its not there. Could you link to a post where I defended these terrorists? And also link to a post where I have 'made the messengers the issue'-not a post where I have said don't hold Islam responsible for the actions of terrorists, but where I have made personally the messengers an issue.
Link to a post where I did that please? The real problem is that you see Islam as a threat to the existance of Christianity you just want to have a dig at Islam for no reason. The people with knowledge and a bit of common sense can seperate terrorism from Islam but people who on purpose want to stir up religious hatred- won't, because then they will have no means of spreading hatred about Islam- well carry on d16man and GTech .
So all this hatred towards Islam is all down to insecurity? You see it as a threat to the existance of individual religions? What about all the 'peace loving peopl' who ARE followers of Islam, Is it a threat to them too?
So you are also like Gtech and look at the people who rape teenage girl and murder civilians as soldiers and your heroes and not criminals that they are. As you mentioned, you have not served because of your "medical" problems so I can understand why you don't know that REAL soldiers despise such people and their supporters as much as civilians do. Do you really think that this is what REAL soldiers who risk their life for their duty want to be known as, rapist and murderers? I don't think so. I think US military and soldiers have already given their opinion about this subject by giving these people years of prisons because of their crimes. It is only sick psychopaths who have spreading hatred as the only purpose in their life will approve of and cheer for rape the rape of teenage girls and murder of civilians. The simple fact that you and Gtech cheer these criminals and refuse to condemn them, speaks volumes about your characters.
just because they have a kebab shop on every street corner in london, doesn't mean they are taking over the whole uk
What hatred? The hatred is what the issues have been about in this thread, that you have time and again derailed. I even pointed out where you started doing it on the previous page and your reaction? "whatever" The hatred is found, directly in the links and references posted in this thread. The problem is, you belong to the religion doing these things. While *you* personally, may or may not subscribe to these things, your outrage has consistently been at those who raise the issues and *not* at the issues themself. The only time you've even mentioned anything regarding the issues, is when pointed out that you are taking issue with the messenger only. Then a quick post to say *your* are not like that, but that has no bearing. *you* are not the subject. The hatred: UK islamic schools using books that describe Christians and Jews as pigs and apes. (you even went into outright denial that this is in the quran and hadith, despite being shown directly it is). The hatred: clerics preaching "death to all kaffir" and "death to those that leave islam" and "reports that 40% of muslims in the UK want sharia law installed" and on and on and on. You are defensive about these issues. Why? Your outrage isn't at the people calling for and doing these things. No, it is one way outrage, with the accompanyment of a dunce (pizzaboy) that openly admits he doesn't know anything and doesn't care what the truth is. In other words, he has a low self-esteem and needs friends. Followed by gworld, a terrorist's best friend. Like the ones in Iraq that want peace, but are constantly threatened to be taken over by terrorists, which is exactly what gworld wants? Many muslims are peaceful people that just want to get on about their lives, *despite* what their religion teaches. But many are not, because they *do* follow their religion according to the quran. The issues is with those people, highlighted in a barrage of news stories in this thread, that *are not* peaceful and DO want to take over the UK. Those are the issues, *not* those (perhaps like yourself??) that do not necessarily subscribe to these things. The issues are the hatred you seek to malign with those being aware of it in the first place. The hatred is here, a number of which have been covered numerous times. It's ashame that rather pointing *these* issues out as hatred, you point out that those who raise these issues and are aware of such, are the hatred. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/li...1770&ico=Homepage&icl=TabModule&icc=NEWS&ct=5 http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1167467834546&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WH_0SlaD4O4&eurl= http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=433030&in_page_id=1770 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/02/04/nterr04.xml http://www.newsoftheworld.co.uk/story_pages/news/news4.shtml http://www.itv.com/news//index_df8bc7a5c24a6dcaf4913105943620a8.html http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2007060114,00.html http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/...pes'+admits+head+of+Islamic+school/article.do
Gtech As person who cheers and supports the rape of teenage girl and murder of innocent civilian, don't you think that it is hypocritical of you to criticize other people's hatred?
Please answer this question with a single yes or no( not an explanation or followed by an explanation): Are all muslims terrorists and bad people? Gtech in your posts you have continued to say that my anger has been directed at the messengers and not the actual issues, I don't know why this is because anyone reading my posts can easily see where my anger has been directed- at that has not been at the 'messengers'- (by the way who are these messengers?- names?) I don't need to continuly point out to you what I said and where my anger is directed because it is pretty self evidant- i.e.NOT at the so called messengers. But because you want my anger to be directed at the messengers so that you can lump all muslims under the terrorists heading and say 'If they aren't against terrorism they must be for it'. So please continue to say something which doesn't have any truth what so ever. Everyone can see the truth which is that my 'anger' is directed at these issues. And about the apes and pig thing the school 'USES' the books, it doesn't 'TEACH' that christians are apes and Jews are pigs. There is a lot of difference between them. But as always you will refuse to accept this because it won't allow you to criticize Islam furthur. DENIAL. And no the links you posted or the 'translations' do not count as concrete evidance. Just because someone said that these verses 'MIGHT' refer to Jews doesn't mean they do. The Quran refers to Jews as Jews and Christians as Christians- ( but then again you already know that its just DENIAL) The 40% that want this- what was the sample size? 5, 10, 20, 100? you can't just believe figures without reading the whole thing, I thought you would have been clever enough to realise that. Please link to a post where I have labelled the messenger- which obviously has to be a poster- as the 'hatred'? Calling people dunce,no friends, low self esteem, terrorists best friend. Back to throwing personal insults again. PLease tremind us what makes you so high and mighty above the rest of us that your posts are worth listening to but others aren't. What happened to love thy neighbour?
No, that is because there is one rule for GTech and another for every one else. All GTechs posts are like verses from the bible whereas all our posts are worthless compared with his. All bow down to the high and mighty GTech. (I am being sarcastic GTech- as you probably didn't realise )
I don't think my posts are worthless....and I find it funny that you seemed to change the topic from you answering GTech's questions to now GTech must answer yours....interesting.
Oh I forgot to note how people that agree with GTech, their posts are fine its just the ones that don't. And why shouldn't GTech answer my questions if I have answered his ( and before you say I haven't- I have). Oh I forgot we should all answer to GTech but not question him. Funny how you seem to worship the ground that GTech walks on and are always there by his side like a loyal .....(you can fill the gap in)...
I for one have never said that I worshiped GTech, my worship is turned toward God...and I was just pointing out that it seems like you like to change the subject, even though you say you have answered his questions (with questions, is that allowed?)...
Phrase the question properly. It's ambiguous. Were you trying to use the "all" card again? Still directing the anger at the messengers, despite the renewed list of links that were the topic of discussion, until you derailed it yesterday by taking it to those that raise the issue, rather than the issue itself. No one is lumping "all" together. In fact, you continue to use this, and four times now, I've called for you to point out where anyone is using "all". Once again, you choose denial as your shield. Splitting hairs over something that has no hair in the first place. This is just another example of your deceitfulness. The teacher even admitted the books contained such. I've documented scriptures from the quran and the hadith. Your response? Using the "translation card" once again. Never a source. Despite overwhelming evidence, including valid polls (no complains over Bush poll numbers too?) videos of clerics in mosques doing such, news stories where muslims are actually calling for such, denial is your choice. Deceitful again. Pretending it didn't happen. This is defending those that actually do this, by raising false and unsubstantiated objections on their behalf. Start back on page nine and work your way forward. That's about where you started derailing the topic. In fact, start just above where you describe those that discuss the issues as "hatred towards islam." It's pretty clear. Once again, making it about the messenger. Not a word about gworld's insults. I wonder why? Thanks, once again, for actually confirming what I'm saying. The post you made went to the very heart of it. In the presence of the actual hatred, those calling for the UK to be taken over, those preaching that the dirty kaffir should be killed, those preaching that any muslim who serves in the British army should be killed, those that teach straight from the quran/hadith that Christians and Jews are apes and pigs, etc, you chose to either defend it, or ignore it and move on to the messengers.
You don't need to say it, it is pretty self evidant. Your worship is towards GTech and Jesus How does it 'seem' like I want to change the subject. If you read GTechs post you will see that there are no questions. So how I have answered questions with questions is beyond me.....
I would like to answer this....No, not all Muslims are terrorists, but it seems to me that all terrorists are Muslim. Furthermore, I do not believe that non-Muslim terrorists do a good enough job of standing up to their mislead brethren. JMO though...