FALSE CHRISTIANITY, ISLAM, and AFRICAN SLAVERY

ALTER2EGO -to- EVERYONE:

Flawed reasoning has caused many people--particularly those of African descent--to reject God. They look at the bad example of false Christians such as the European slavers and proceed to reject God, Christianity, and the Judeo-Christian Bible. In reality, the European slavers merely claimed they worshipped God. They demonstrated by their brutality towards those they enslaved that they never adopted Godly qualities. Therefore, they were rejected by God. Concerning such ones, Jesus Christ said the following.

"{15} Be on the watch for the false prophets that come to you in sheep's covering, but inside they are ravenous wolves. {16} by their fruits [meaning their actions] you will recognize them. Never do people gather grapes from thorns or figs from thistles, do they? {17} Likewise every good tree produces fine fruit, but every rotten tree produces worthless fruit. {20} Really, then, by their fruits you will recognize those men." (Matthew 7:15-17, 20)



COMMENTARY: The Judeo-Christian Bible was handed down through the Jews--not through the Europeans. The last book of the Bible was completed in 98 AD or in the 1st century AD. Jesus Christ who was born into a Jewish family established Christianity during the 1st century AD. After his death in 33 AD and the violent persecution of his early disciples by the ROMANS/Europeans, some of those very same Romans became "Christianized" and proceeded to call themselves Roman Catholics.

The Europeans commenced their scramble for Africa in the 15th Century AD or 1,400 years after the completion of the Bible and 1,400 years after the establishment of Christianity by Jesus Christ and his Jewish disciples. In other words, the Europeans who committed human rights violations against people of color were not representative of true Christians and they DID NOT write a single word of scripture in the Judeo-Christian Bible. Therefore, rejecting God, the Bible, and Christianity on their account is a pointless gesture.


BTW: The Bible's authenticity has been proven by the accurate fulfillment of almost 2,000 Bible prophecies, some written centuries before the occurrence of the prophesied events. The fulfillment of many of these prophesies has been confirmed by secular history and archeology--neither of which is affiliated with the Bible.
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What exactly are you trying to say here? It seems that you are putting 21st century emotions onto the actions of 15th century people and not making a very good job of it by picking and choosing random quotes and comments.

FYI the Bible was most certainly not handed down through the Jews. They do not acknowledge the New Testament as being "legitimate" but do acknowledge Jesus as being a prophet.

You also seem to conveniently ignore the part played by the Arab world in the collection and transportation of African slaves.

Would you care to share some of these 2000 so called prophecies that you say have been fulfilled?

 

The Christians who took the Africans as slaves did so because the bible said it was OK.


"However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance.

Leviticus 25:44-46

 

Says the guy who supports enslaving kids in Sharia schools .

 

Says the gipsy that sends his kids to beg in European cities.

 

ALTER2EGO -to- PAUL SCH:
Which "random quotes and comments" are you referring to? I quoted one single scripture. All of the comments are mine based upon my conversations with native Africans as well as with African-Americans. My comments are also based upon my personal research of the Atlantic slave trade during which I read slave narratives and several history books on the hypocrisy of the European "Christians."

ALTER2EGO -to- PAUL SCH:
Something being handed down indicates the writers were all Jews--and I'm talking the Old Testament (the Hebrew Scriptures) as well as the New Testament (the Greek Scriptures). All 66 books of the Bible were written by Jews. Your argument is that because the Jews overwhelmingly reject Jesus Christ as the Messiah and they reject Christianity and the Greek Scriptures (New Testament), that equates to: "The Bible did not come through the Jews." The point is that all the Bible writers were Jews, regardless of whether or not they accepted certain parts of the Bible. That's what I meant when I said the Bible was handed down through the Jews.

 

Many Europeans have historically been victims of the slave trade. As an example, read about the Barbary Pirates.

As far as African slavery, it has been said some religious people may have justified it with the "curse of ham." As an example, while the JW's started around the 1870's, it appears they may have believed in it to an extent for 60 years, at least to 1929...

The Golden Age was a JW publication, it is now renamed to AWAKE.

But, yes, slavery of all types is horrible.

 

ALTER2EGO -to- REBECCA:

Sorry, but this thread is not about what Europeans did to each other. As a black woman, I could care less what whites did to one another. The issue of this thread is fake European Christians who thought they had a God-given right to brutalize and dehumanize people of color by erroneously applying the Biblical curse against Canaan to black people. Additionally, the issue of this thread is about Arab Muslims who plagiarized the Hebrew Scriptures into their Quran and proceeded to quote scripture about the curse against Canaan—to justify the Arab enslavement of African blacks.

So as far as your link on Barbary Pirates is concerned, I'll pass. I'm not interested in white-on-white crime. This thread is about white-on-black crime and Arab-on-black crime aka the Atlantic Slave Trade.

 

The bible glorifies Jews. It teaches that God's son is a Jew (Jesus). It speaks ill about blacks. It is of no surprise that educated black people are leaving Christianity these days. Why worship a white Jew eh ?

 

I think that is a particularly ugly statement. I'm sorry if you can't care about humans who have a different shade of skin than you.

 

ALTER2EGO -to- REBECCA:
Uglier still is what white "Christians" did to people of color that they described as subhumans. They raped under-aged black females and impregnated them with children that were then sold off like livestock. They whipped black men within inches of taking their lives. They worked black people 14 hours a day or longer--7 days a week. They sold human beings on the auction block and branded them like cattle, and they did this for centuries. Let's deal with that.

Do you think I'm not slick to what you're attempting? You're attempting to minimize what European "Christians" did to black people by making it seem that slavery was just a normal event and whites did it to themselves too. Anyone who has studied slavery--as I have done--will tell you there are different forms of slavery. Some forms of slavery are more humane. Compared to what the European "Christians" did to blacks, what they did to each other pales in comparison.


Don't come up here on this forum acting self-righteous, telling me how ugly my statement is. That's another slick move on your part to change the topic of this thread. I feel no shame in saying what I previously said. The way whites behave today towards people of color is directly related to what happened way back there. I'm speaking from personal experience as one who has been on the receiving end of white bigotry.

At least European slavers didn't hack off the foot of runaway white slaves or allowed their blood hounds to tear runaway white slaves to bits, as they did with slaves brought to the Americas. At least they didn't burn their white slaves to death for stealing food--like they did underfed black slaves here in the USA. There is no comparison between white-on-white slavery and white-on-black slavery.

Again, this thread is about what the "saintly" European "Christians" did to black people while waving around the Bible and singing "hallelujah." It's also about what the Muslim hypocrites did to black slaves while they lyingly claimed Islam is a religion of peace. Let's deal with that.

 

ALTER2EGO -to- MIKAËL:

The book of Leviticus was written in 1512 B.C.E. or 3,524 years ago and applied ONLY to the ancient Israelites who were under the Mosaic Law. The Mosaic Law did not apply to non-Jews aka Gentiles and certainly does not apply to Christians. In fact, Jesus Christ made it clear that he fulfilled the Mosaic Law and thereby cancelled it out, as follows.

"Do not think I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I came, not to destroy but TO FULFILL;" (Matthew 5:17)

Once something is fulfilled, it's done away with and only its principles remain. Got that?

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I've already figured out why you're attempting to make an issue of slavery in the Bible (which, by the way, was considered a humane form of slavery). The reason is that you hope to divert attention away from the fact that Muslim Arabs were enslaving and brutalizing black people from the 7th century AD. The European "Christians" did not make their scramble for Africa until the 15th century AD. In other words, the Muslim Arabs had 800 years of head start and did far more damage to Africa than the European "Christians." Not only that, to this day—in the 21st century AD—Muslims are still enslaving blacks in Africa. That, in and of itself, indicates Islam's claim of being a religion of "peace, purity, submission and obedience" is nothing more than window dressing.


QUESTION #1 to MIKAËL: If Islam is the religion of "peace, purity, submission and obedience," why are Muslims still enslaving fellow humans when the Judeo-Christian Bible says the following?

"If anyone makes the statement: 'I love God,' and yet is hating his brother, he is a liar. For he who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot be loving God, whom he has not seen." (1 John 4:20)


QUESTION #2 to MIKAËL: What's "peaceful" about brutalizing fellow humans?


QUESTION #3 to MIKAËL: What lame excuse can you dream up as a reason why Muslims are still enslaving people in this day and age?

 

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What about 1 Timothy 6:1 ?

I have found that Islam is much more peaceful than Judaism and Christianity.

Mohamed was in the habit of freeing slaves, he bought slaves and then freed them. He encouraged others to do the same. In total Mohamed and his disciples freed 40,000 slaves.

 

It sounds like you're trying to justify your own feelings of racism. Or, what I perceive to be racism. You said you don't care about crime against whites by whites. Because, you said, you're a black woman. What a limited way of thinking. Is all that you have going on, just the color of your skin? I don't think it's what should define us as human beings. I'm not attempting to minimize African slavery, words can't even express what a tragic, dark history it is. But we should not ignore the wider view. Africans were not the only to suffer from slavery. If you understand the history, you'll know how wrong your premise is. But you want someone to blame. We can also blame the Africans that sold them, helping to make it all possible. >>>

 

ALTER2EGO -to- REBECCA:
When you've walked in the shoes of any black person, then you will know what I'm talking about. It has less to do with me being bigoted than with me being realistic and speaking from experience. Unlike you, I'm aware of how the judicial system in the USA disproportionately incarcerates people of color. Unlike you, I'm aware of what happens when the police pulls over a black motorist for DWB aka Driving While Black. Unlike you, I am aware that more qualified blacks in the USA are routinely passed over for jobs that are given to Caucasians who are less qualified. This reality is the result of the past centuries of whites enslaving blacks. It created a culture in which racial attitudes have been passed down from one generation to the next. You are blissfully unaware of all this--or so you would have me believe--because you do not belong to the group that is on the receiving end.

 

You know, the comment in bold could have just as easily been uttered by any member on the Stormfront forum. And, with the "until you've walked in the shoes of any black person" please don't pretend you're speaking for the entire black community. Take personal responsibility for your own racist remark. Exactly what is "realistic and speaking from experience" about not caring what happens to white people? As far as the existence of discrimination, I would agree. But looking from a wider perspective, I can see sometimes the elderly are also discriminated against, or the LGBT community, men, women, young people, religious, atheists, the list goes on. This is probably not something you're concerned by unless they have a specific skin color. Anyway, hope you get happier. I'm off to do more productive things.

 

ALTER2EGO -to- REBECCA:
I gave you the above response because you insisted I was basing my comments on people's skin color. So I elaborated and informed you that I base my comments on personal experience. I also mentioned the fact that blacks are disproportionately incarcerated and that they are often harassed for Driving While Black.

You wouldn't know anything about that; now would you? If you did, you would deny that blacks are disproportionately incarcerated in the USA and you would deny that blacks in the USA are frequently harassed by white cops for Driving While Black. You would also deny that unarmed blacks in the USA are occasionally riddled with bullets by white cops. Knowing you, you would also argue that there was nothing wrong about the judicial system in the USA that only just recently changed a law in which blacks got the same prison sentence for being in possession of 5 grams of crack cocaine as a white person who was caught with 500 grams of powder cocaine.
http://www.usnews.com/news/national/articles/2007/10/01/crack-vs-powder-cocaine-a-gulf-in-penalties

No matter what response I give you, your apologist attitude will cause you to twist it and justify--in your mind--that I am the racist in this conversation and you are not. In fact, as you've demonstrated, the European "Christians" who enslaved black people for centuries weren't all that bad. After all, they enslaved whites as well. Never mind that they never referred to fellow whites as subhumans and treated them like livestock--branding them, auctioning them off, selling them to various plantations and thereby splitting up families forever, raping black children, torturing by whipping and hacking off limbs. None of that happened to white slaves. But to hear you tell it, I am the bigot for bringing it up and for insisting that I'm not interested in white-on-white slavery.

You remind me of the people on the Rodney King jury who watched those white cops beating King like an animal and then they found the cops not guilty because as they saw it, the cops didn't do anything wrong. That's what you remind me of. The worse kind of racists is a racist-in-denial. They will come to the defense of people who look like themselves and go on the attack against those that were on the receiving end of the human rights violations. The entire time they will lie to themselves by claiming: "We love all people equally."

 

ALTER2EGO -to- MIKAËL:
What about 1 Timothy 6:1? You tell me.

ALTER2EGO -to- MIKAËL:
That's not what I asked you. I'm waiting for your answer to my three questions above.

ALTER2EGO -to- MIKAËL:
The Muslim Arabs were enslaving African blacks starting from the 7th century AD. They kept at it for about 1,000 years until the European "Christians" kicked them to the curb. The Muslim Arabs were as brutal as the European "Christians." In fact they killed more blacks than the European slavers for the simple reason that they spent a longer time than the Europeans enslaving black people. Compare that to the "40,000" you claim Muhammad set free. Let's talk about that.

 

What I've said about African slavery is "...words can't even express what a tragic, dark history it is." I haven't minimized it, as you have dishonestly accused me of. However, you have insinuated the slavery of whites was not that bad. And, as far as being racist, you're the one that can't seem to see past the color of skin, and has an apparent anger at white people in general. I think you should continue the conversation with Mikael, you both have a great deal in common.

 

ALTER2EGO -to- REBECCA:
Excuse me, this is not about you and what you decide you can stomach by agreeing to it. This thread is specifically about the Atlantic Slave Trade and the resulting culture of racial bigotry among people of European descent towards blacks to this day. During the American Civil War, Caucasian-Americans ended up slaughtering each other because those in the South could not bear to let go of all that free labor and those 11 and 12-year-old black girls they were raping. Thomas Jefferson owned 200 black slaves, had children with his under-aged black slave girl, and had no trouble spouting from one side of his face that "all men are created equal."


The fact that you keep trying to change the topic of this thread speaks volumes. Nobody who had any real remorse for what their fellow whites did to native Africans (and others) would be up in here trying to minimize it and then trying to change the topic by pointing fingers and accusing the OP of making "racist remarks" simply because the OP stated disinterest in white-on-white slavery.

Nobody who had shame over the human rights violations committed by their white ancestors would be up in a thread dealing with the European enslavement of blacks and its aftermath, by accusing the OP of being a racist because the OP mentioned her personal experiences as a recipient of white-on-black discrimination. Only an apologist for white racial bigotry would have shown up in a thread like this arguing about discrimination against "the LGBT community, men, women, young people, religious, atheists," and every Tom, Dick, and Harry.

Then you have the nerve to call me a racist simply for presenting the facts and for presenting my personal bad experiences. There's a difference between a racist and a realist. I'm a realist. I see things as they are because that's what the record of history says. But talk about the pot calling the kettle black.