Wulkanen: We're talking about the properties of science. First of all, I am an Edenist and only speak for the existence of the Garden (Earth) and only have Faith in its Creator - as we are expelled by the Creator it is improper for any other reference......believe as you chose, yourself. You are the one contradicting my notion that Faith may someday be rewarded by admission to the Outerworld of the Everlasting. Just as in Science (Science produces tangible results when properly formulated, the A-bomb became existent when the proper formula was discovered) Faith also when properly formulated brings the Knowledge it has sought to discover and likewise becomes Tangible.......there is no contradiction with Science. Science, Faith or any other Admonition sought by Mankind are first derived from the same source, the free will and open mind of the Individual who seeks a solution and for which all that exists has an answer.
I never said that science TOLD you to. I said that science had an EFFECT on the way you think. You also seem to mix up science and technology. Science = knowledge. Technology = art, skill, craft. Sure, technology in the wrong hands can be devastating in the ways you described. In fact, a human does not need anything more than his fists to cause massive damage. Science, as I described in my above comment has the ability to change ones morality. It does not give a list of what's wrong and right. Science will never have a list of what's wrong and right since it's a work in progress. The more knowledge we gain, the better we will understand things. And by understanding things differently than we did before, we might change our morality. You seem to have totally missed the point of my comment.
I did not miss your point. I started the arguement when someone said science is the only thing which matters and god etc is stupid but i said that there is something called morality which only complex species like humans can understand. There has to be a limit on science. Our morality is not progressing as fast as science. Previously no one could have though of destroying a city or nation in one go. But now we can destroy it with nuclear weapons. Morally we should stop nuclear thing because bad people will always be there and if they access it it can result in havoc.
Well, humans have never really learned quickly enough to handle its own knowledge. We learn a lot from our mistakes, but that does not hold us back from discovering new things that might hurt us if they are given to the wrong persons. Since we are all different I believe that there will never be a Utopia.
As I wrote, "I guess logic is something Wulkanen is not burdened with." This is absolutely TRUE. It takes inner strength and focus to have faith. Religion teaches a society good and evil. Without religious instruction it is rare that someone can develop that sense. In a psychological sense, evil is when someone is either indifferent, or is joyful, at the suffering of others.
First of all, my logical thinking is most likely way above yours. Secondly, you have no proof what so ever that the most intelligent people are intelligent because of religion. Thirdly, everyone can learn whats good and evil without religion.
1. I am studying Computer science. One of the most active areas when it comes to logical thinking, just google it. When I'm done I will have a Bachelor of Science with a major in Computer Engineering. I have also completed 3 years of IT studies at high school with top grades. What do you have? 2. Heres a short list: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_atheists_in_science_and_technology 3. What the F is that even supposed to mean? Now stop leaving worthless replies that just makes yourself look stupid.
LOL ! Everyone in a public forum can say anything. Stop lying. Your in a basement of your Mom. See ya.
So if I was lying would I be able to post a pdf directly created from my college with my name on it? http://www.xmakemoneyonline.com/wp-...47011036106564117F7B53D135DD753547B67BB09.pdf Here is a link to what I'm studying: http://www.hv.se/extra/pod/?action=...=visaprog&fullwidth=true&lang=sv§ion=data And no, I have my own apartment in. Country: Sweden Region: Västra götaland City: Trollhättan Street: Mjölnaregatan 16 Now please take my advice and stop posting stupid things.
It's science and technology. Your so attached to it and I can say it can be a counterfeit. My dear Wulka, You can post whatever link in the internet as you like, people can even post that they even have a phd on BS Affairs. Shit me not, you live 5 blocks away from me and 2 blocks away from Bjorn Borg. Now take my advice, you can post shit and call me stupid whatever you like. We can dispute the technology and counterfeit you post for eternity or just ask if I have faith and belief and we can end this. Sincerely Yours, Credo
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Um, wow. I never claimed that intelligent people are intelligent because of religion. So much for your "logical thinking". You have no proof whatsoever that people can learn good and evil without religion. What we CAN learn from you, Wulkanen, is that you are a liar. We are using to having intelligent discussions in P&R, and we are all sure that you just make shit up. I have an Associates Degree in Engineering Science (A.S.E.) and a Bachelors of Electrical Engineering (B.S.E.E). I have also done graduate work at M.I.T. I got top grades in Calculus. When I started work as an Engineer, I found that what you learn in college is just the tip of the iceberg - real world Electrical Engineering has a devotion to logic that is religious in it's zeal. I hold a patent for automotive traction control systems and sat on the boards of the Society of Professional Engineers and also the Society of Automotive Engineers (S.A.E. - no, I didn't grade motor oil). One of the most active areas when it comes to logical thinking is designing automotive and military electronic systems. Some of my work is in engine control systems, airbags, and missile control systems. Let me assure you, these things don't work by making things up - the science must be solid and the testing is harsh. You must expect the unexpected. You may be studying CS, but let me assure you, when you have to write code for real-world mission-critical systems, it just starts with your logic. You also have to be prepared for when the illogical happens. Honestly, Wulkanen, from you I don't see the skills. I mean your communication skills. They suck. Badly. In the real world, it's no use understanding logic if you can't communicate your logic in a clear and effective way so as to convince others of your point of view. I mean, you just throw words out there and expect people to believe them. PEOPLE don't work that way because people are not computers. You may eventually get to work with computers, but you need to be hired by, and work for, people. Now, like popotalk told you, stop posting shit and calling people stupid. There's absolutely no logic in it. You've convinced no one. All you've done is make yourself look foolish.
You're just agry because I said that everyone can learn good and bad without religion. Many countries lack religious belief and they're doing well. There is no need for a "god". I have provided facts, so far you have not. You replied to this comment: "The most intelligent and thoughtful people are all Religious, as they seek power from their inside and they have strong faith in their religion and what ever they do." And said: "This is absolutely TRUE. It takes inner strength and focus to have faith." Do you have a bad memory? Also, you have no proof that you need religion in order to learn good or bad. There are plenty of countries where the majority of the population lack religious beliefs, and they're doing just fine.
Well wulkanen you are mistaken if science is the answer or solution to lead a happy life. You say science helps in devolepment, well its not development that matters its the hapiness. We look at humans 300 years ago and say how backward were they, after 300 years if they look back they will say how crap were we 300 years ago and so on. So science may lead to devolopment bt devolopment may not neccassarily lead to hapiness. There are MNC's who are making millions of dollars a day and still not satisfied and they are dissapointed that they are not the best even though they are making millions of dollars and there are more than a billion people out of 6 billion who are hungry. Here is a must read for you and anyone who has come to this thread.
I never said science brought happiness. (Even though it can in some ways, for example in medical advancement, saving lives) It's up to each one of us to find what brings happiness to them. For me, happiness is being able to spend time with friends and family, to not be ill or see others suffer. I don't really care if I would make a million dollars tomorrow (even though I want to) because it's not what matters the most for me. I have lost a lot of friends and relatives, I suppose that's why I value the ones I have so highly. I will read the thing you quoted later, right now I don't have time to. =(
No, you have made broad statements of opinion that you have not "qualified". The above statements are examples. You expect and demand that people completely accept everything you write while you provide no qualifying (backup) statements. That is not logical. I never claimed that intelligent people are intelligent because of religion Your logic is faulty. You are assuming that, my point is that people have inner strength because of religious. That is a logical fallacy. It may be true on some cases, but I do not believe it is true in all cases. My point is that people that have inner-strength and focus are religious. I know many religious people that do not have inner-strength or focus. Do you see the logic here? A religious education necessitates that a person be taught the morality of that religion, right? Every religion has a "code of conduct". Religion, by it's very nature, teaches a morality, based upon a code of conduct that enables the religious to reach heaven/nirvana/redemption/chocolate. Immorality is punished by hell/unhappiness/misery/etc. Anthropologist and social scientist Gregory Bateson's Logical Levels states that, at the very highest level, who we are and our basic behaviors are defined by our spirituality (see the book "Beliefs" by psychologist Robert Dilts). With "1" being the most influential and "6" the least influential, a person's behavior and morality is dictated by: 1. Spirituality/Religion (Purpose) 2. Identity (Mission/Strategy) 3. Beliefs (Motivation) 4. Capabilities (Plans/Tactics) 5. Behavior (Actions & Reactions) 6. Environment (Constraints) A change in the upper levels MUST change the lower levels, but a change in the lower levels has a weak or little effect on the upper levels. Spirituality/Religion has the greatest effect on a person's behaviors, morality, and concept of right & wrong. This model is the basis of motivational psychology. Is this too logical and scientific for you?
a mix of everything!!! i think there are stupid people and smart people regardless of what they believe. though i think atheist take higher faith, than theist do.
Hello all, my opinion is that no one can tell to anyone in what to believe or what exist or not. The only thing that people who are believing in a higher plain of existence is that they are tricked into "I need your money to finish GOD`S work" because there are some shameless people out there.
I don't think religious people are stupid. Believing in something so strongly and it works for you don't make you stupid same goes for the atheists. Atheists have the right not to believe in anything but shouldn't call the religious one stupid because they are almost the same just that one actually believes in something supernatural and atheists don't.