One of the best scientific explanations I have heard... Coming from a physics back ground myself I was hoping for more feelings and thoughts... But your explanation hits the nail on the head, so to speak.
On that subject i think there is something after this life but what it is i have no ideah i think it is something totally differnt then what we are tought to belive. To me i think every religion is a business and isnt true but thats me.. But i do think there is something afterwards and we are not alone in the universe.
Of course there is something afterwards. But what makes you think there is something afterwards FOR YOU?
I agree 100 percent, the only reason atheists are dead set in their neanderthalic worldview of no life after death is that looking at honestly would compell them to admit that they are wrong and that the soul does indeed live on after death. Anyone with just a pinche of education and rationale would know this, especially with the many well documented cases of veridical nde's being written down in medical journals , but my guess is that you will cling to your atheistic fantasy of faith that once we die that we cease to exist. This is also why it would basically take me just a few minutes to debunk atheism as a rational worldview and I wouldn't even need a bible to do it. If any of you open minded people would like to learn more just google it. God bless
while there are people that use religion as a business (pharsees) it doesn't mean that all religions are false. In order for you to know means that you have researched at a minimum, the major religions of the world, but I do respect the honesty you showed in saying this is only your opinion. Hope you make that journey one day my friend good luck
Adults afraid of the dark. it's pathetic. When i meet my end i hope to meet it with dignity and strength, not like some gutless, snivelling cry baby begging for another life because they wasted this one.
Did I not prove point folks. This is the exact of why atheism has been passed by as a coherent worldview lol. How can someone meet their end in a worldview that has been shown to be unintelligent with dignity. There is no dignity in being stubborn. I stand by my statement that even modern medicine has proven atheism to be rediculous and inhabited by people that can't can't use common sense. It's ironic that the message on your signature has been flipped around and turned against you my friend. God bless
There is a dignity in accepting reality and not trying to convince yourself otherwise purely because it frightens you - Maybe you should grow a pair of danglers and stop begging imaginary men to save you. If your magical never never land exists, which it almost certainly doesn't, i'll be going there, whether i believe in it now or not. Because if a god exists, which it almost certainly doesn't, it's doubtful that it would be the repugnant, self obsessed, misogynistic, serial killing monster that your particular grotty little death cult worships. That doesn't even make any sense. What i will say though is hospitals are full of people like you when they get ill, your churches contain nobody from my side. This is what makes me laugh about these so called "believers". They spout this empty rhetoric and noisy proclamations about how much conviction they have, but when it matters, they come running to us. When it really matters, all of a sudden, the certainty seems to shrink and they opt not for their god with his plan and divine intervention, but for science. Secular science and the overwhelmingly atheist community that provides it for them. You're welcome. So while they regale us of tales about what will happen to us in the never never and how disappointed we will be they are demonstrating that they are wrong now. Not just demonstrating it that they are wrong, but demonstrating that they know they are wrong and don't actually believe it any more than i do. "Cancer? Fuck jebus, where's my doctor!" - gutless, ungrateful hypocrites.
How many times does a person have to stick their foot in their mouth before they realize that they have lost. In typical atheist fashion you sidestep the issue of veridical nde's completely and go on an angry tirade of abuse against religious people to try and hope I have forgotten about the evidence. This is a classical case of a person being scared of their worldview and their beliefs being proven wrong. Emotional tirades won't change the facts my friend. This is also why most intelligent atheist,materialists and naturalists beg their comrades to stay away from this subject, but alas you have chosen to run headfirst into a brickwall. Hurts doesn't it? I won't say anymore my friend as it might make you more angry than you allready are. Ever though of gettinghelp for this?
Like Stephen Hawking said, heaven is a fairytale invented by people who are afraid of the dark (non-existence). And the idea that we would spend eternity in a hell of torture must rank as one of the most absurd superstitions invented by the human mind. None of our short lives, no matter how "evil", could justify an eternity of torment as punishment.
Sickearth, where are they? I have mentioned veridical near death experiences 3 straight posts now. Why not look into it. They are all over the place in medical journals and there are many doctors that have written these down in medical journals. Remember im talking about veridical nde's not regular nde's. Veridical ones have compelling facts such as a person seeing exactly whats being done to them on the operating table even though their eyes are closed, and they are brain dead and heart dead. This is just one example of a near death experience that is experienced veridically. here is a good place to start your research into it. http://www.garyhabermas.com/articles/Bibliotheca-Sacra/habermas_BtS_paradigm-shift.htm and if you want the facts just email habermas or any other doctor currently doing studies into nde's and they will provide you with the deatailed medical journal listing. Remember that 80% of doctors are either spiritual or believe in God, and these types of Nde's are just one part of why they do. Remember that Habermas was also an ignorant mean spirited skeptic that said mean things to Christians before he himself converted to christianity. There are many doctors that have reported these types of nde's. There are even peer research studies underway in denark, but then again Stox will sidestep this subject again and try to make a case for these things being figments of the imagination. As I said before veridical near death experiences shatter the atheistic, naturalistic, materialistic worldview to the point that naturalists are being embarressed by these findings. Stox this will be my last post on this subject because it seems to me that you are being effected emotionally by this and since your worldview is based on anger and emotionalism I will not push you over the edge. So much for the rationalism and intellectualism of atheism. Now while it doesnt give 100% proof for the christian world view it shows that the minimal, rational world view should be spiritualism, which can be the beginning of the journey towards God, but it also makes belief in God very reasonable. I try not to post much here as I have now debated with much more advanced atheists then are here. Ill just leave Stox to his comfortable fantasy world of atheism and let him be happy with it (no matter how rediculous or proven wrong it is) Stox just open your heart (yes we have one) and your soul to the truth and your anger will subside and you will learn how to love again Enough with tossing the pearls before swine. God bless p. 445 minimalistic view of life after death. Two points in particular will be mentioned: corroborative experiences and corroborative testing.33 Many cases have been reported in which dying persons viewed individuals, events, or circumstances in another place with amazing accuracy when they were comatose. In other words they reported independently corroborative data that would not normally have been in the range of their sense experience even if they were fully conscious at the time, in spite of the fact that they were near death or already pronounced dead. Some of these reports were investigated using rather ingenious controls and other quantitative data. This research found that at least some of these persons reported facts that they could not have known by natural means. Another type of corroboration is from cases in which an individual, after a near-death experience, reports having just seen a loved one whom he claims was also deceased. In the more evidential cases, the loved one was not previously known to have been dead either by the one who was near death or in some cases by anyone immediately involved. As a result, the experiencer was sometimes so convicted that his entire attitude toward death was altered to a sense of peace, well-being, and even a desire to be with the loved one. Later it was discovered that the other individual had already died, sometimes at that very hour. Some near-death experiences have been reported during the absence of brain waves. Eminent cardiologist Schoonmaker announced the results of his 18-year study of 1,400 near-death experiences, including those of about 55 persons whose experiences took place while flat EEG readings were recorded.34 The most vivid experiences these people had, many of which were also corroborative, occurred when their brains registered no known activity, sometimes for periods of 30 minutes to three hours. This is strong evidence that consciousness may exist after death. It is of course conceivable that the EEG may not in fact measure all brain activity (though at the present time the absence of brain wave function in the EEG is both the best and the most widely accepted definition of brain death). Independently corroborative experiences and testing also compliment each other. While there was no brain or heart activity, individuals have reported near-death experiences that were independently verified by others, even over a distance. A woman with a flat EEG reading and no vital signs had been declared dead. She sponta- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 33. The following data are the result of a lengthy investigation to be presented in a forthcoming book on the subject of evidence for life after death. 34. Some of this information was received from a personal interview with Fred Schoonmaker, June 1, 1982. neously revived about three and one-half hours later. She reported floating above her body during the resuscitation attempts. She described precisely the procedures used to try to rescue her, how many persons came into the room, what was said (she even related a joke that was told to relieve the tension), and most interestingly, she reported the designs on the doctors' ties. All of this information was carefully checked with the medical records and with the doctors who were present, and it was discovered that her total description was correct, even though her EEG reading was flat during this time.35 This combination of flat EEG readings and empirically corroborative scientific data presents strong evidence for at least a minimalistic view of life after death, which disproves a major pillar of naturalistic thought. In fact even the many other cases of clinical (or reversible) death that are accompanied by corroboration, sometimes of a rather spectacular variety, are also good evidence since these verified observations themselves are unexplained in known natural terms and because they evidence consciousness beyond the initial states of death. This consciousness presents evidence strong enough to indicate a probable case for the initial stages of life after death.
Omicreon, if there is compelling evidence for a spiritual life after death (even a minimalistic one) then its reasonable to believe in God (and medical evidence shows this as much as you want to keep repeating otherwise. and if there is a hell then it is very important to you to learn more about it. I dont think you are God and I dont think you can fully understand how much a sin does kill the spirit. Hell is simply being away from God. If there is ultimate Good then there is ultimate evil, and if its true none of your complaints and looking at it from a limited and finite materialistic view can change it. Now I am digressing away from the core subject as Stox is. what your asking my friend is a philosophical question. What we are talking about is the compelling medical evidence, and it points towards a minimal view of a life after death and a survival of conscienseness. If you are looking to prove me wrong be my guest and previdence evidence against these veridal nde's. The top naturalist and materialists in the world couldnt doit and they have been for the last 15 years trying to unsuccessfully come up with a naturalistic eplanation here. Im pretty confident that a person of your intellect wont be able to succeed where they failed.
Please links to these medical journals ( such as www.thelancet.com and alike, no need for some stupid blogs) Yeah, yeah, whatever. From the link that your posted: "it has already been acknowledged that none of these persons has actually suffered biological (irreversible) death" Read your own links next time before posting about something that you have no idea about . K? Remember? What is that an established fact or something? That was probably a small survey somewhere in the Bible Belt, where people HAVE to go to some church or /and claim beliefs in order to "look good" socially. What?! 100% proof? Now you are trying to ping christianity to these non-existent events? Why not Bulbas, Lithuanian God of Beer? He is as likely to be as much of a god as your Jeebus and his homicidal sadistic father. I'd love to see how you grew from the wet spot that they left there. Must be nothing short of T-1000 or whatever was the name of that liquid cyborg-terminator. Hey brothers! It's a Miracle! Haleluuya Amen!
Sickearth actually that stupid blog is from doctor gary habermas who has been researching this for 15 years, but its cool lets bring up some stuff from medical journals just because your not willing (or scared to) research this on your own. "it has already been acknowledged that none of these persons has actually suffered biological (irreversible) death" This is about the silliest response I have yet to get. They were clinically dead with no brain or heart activity. The cold hard medical facts are that when a person's heart stops they lose total consciousness within seconds. The loss of consciousness is complete and there are no memories of the event. EEG and brain stem monitors show no brain activity while in this state. There is no gag reflex, no pupil response, no brain activity whatsoever. They are dead. The brain cannot produce images in this state, and even if it could, you couldn't remember them. Just because a person has been dead for weeks and their body has decayed to the point where their blood , nerves etc etc can no longer function even if the soul comes back doesnt say anything against veridical ndes accept the fact that your trying to change the subject lol. Ring, Kenneth and Cooper, Sharon. 1999. Near-Death and Out-of-Body Experiences in the Blind: A Study of Apparent Eyeless Vision. Palo Alto, CA: Institute of Transpersonal Psychology/William James Center. One of the best studies now is Kenneth Ring's (1999) study of blind people, covered in his upcoming book. He has about thirty people, many of whom are blind from birth, who have had either NDEs or OBEs in which they were able to see. They vary in detail, but some are quite impressive. In one case, a birth-blind subject had received a tie from a friend without his friend describing it. After his OBE, he was able to accurately describe the tie and its colors. Ring did not conclude that these people were actually seeing; he posited an extracorporeal sense of which we are not normally aware. This relates to yogic lore that claims that seeing is a function of the mind rather than the brain and eyes, which only act as filters. Ring, Kenneth, Ph.d. & Lawrence, Madeline, R.N., Ph.D. "Further evidence for veridical perception during near-death experiences", Journal of Near-Death Studies, 1993 11 (4)223-229 There have been cases where people have had OBEs, and seen things from an out-of-body perspective that they could not have seen from their body's location. This writer holds that the brain is involved in triggering OBEs, but once they're happening, other mechanisms predominate. A nurse at Hartford Hospital states that she worked with a patient described an NDE in which she saw a red shoe on the roof of the hospital during her OBE, which a janitor then retrieved. Kenneth Ring describes three such cases involving shoes, shoelaces and a yellow smock and also tells a story from a Seattle social worker who also retrieved a shoe outside a window ledge that was identified by a patient during an NDE. As far as the survey of doctors that believe in God I would think that 1044 doctors nation wide is a pretty good indicator . Sorry to burst your atheist supremecy bubble but thats a pretty good sized number. Can you intelligablize what nationwide means or do I need to pull up the definition from an encyclopedia? lol http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8318894.../t/survey-most-doctors-believe-god-afterlife/ Important to end-of-life issues The study is based on responses to questionnaires mailed in 2003. It is to appear in an upcoming issue of the Journal of General Internal Medicine and was released online to subscribers earlier this month As I said before all of this is just the tip of the iceburg and while as I stated many times that veridical nde's dont 100% prove christianity they are very friendly and compelling to the idea of an afterlife. This is why an atheist like you wont even do the homework to look through this stuff on your own. The mark of an intellectually lazy person (atheist) is that they love to be spoon fed information to then try to debunk it.This is called extreme or irrational skepticism. I could go on and on and on to get more info but as I stated correctly before veridical nde's are in medical journals, all you have to do is dig them up which I have started you out here. To end this post, veridical nde's totally kill atheism, naturalism, and materialism as rationally coherent worldviews, and these alone show that a bare minimum worldview should be spiritualism, from there you will have to combine other factors to show what worldview makes most sense. Historicity, philosophical etc ect etc as far as who I tell God to bless, if you havent looked through my old posts, I ask God to bless everyone, even you. I even pray for christopher hitchens to get well from his cancer. I dont hate anyone enough to wish for their death or anything bad to ever happen to them. Hopefully you can see past your mental and emotional blinders to start looking at the truth (which atheism laughingly isnt). Good luck and maybe one day you can bring some coherency into this subject.
Omicreon unfortunately since you dont possess any objective moral foundation you automatically are eliminated from saying what evil is justified or what evil isnt. This is the funniest thing about atheists. Atheists are nothing more then nihilists in denial of meaninglessness.
Yes there is definitely life after death. If you want heaven so you must do some good work in your life.
This is a debatable issue. Science has yet to find out and come to a conclusion, but various religion have a different beliefs. People follow those. I believe there definitely lies something after wards, but the better option would be to Love & Live your Life with full enjoyment till you die.
Death is part of the plan and all of us needs to undergo this process. Hence, our actions, choices, thoughts, and words are the measurements of what kind of prize we are going to receive after this mortality period. We all want to be in a blissful place and ending but we can't wish for paradise if our deeds are equal to hell. Everyday is a preparation stage for us. It's dreadful if we are not ready but that would be a great day if we have lived our lives in harmony with His will. It's not easy because temptations and our own weakness hinder us. When that time comes, hope we are ready and happy.