Before I broke down and started using CSS just this year, I felt I could use tables so well that I could do anything with them. Now, using CSS I can do some great things, and I love it, but my brain doesn't generate ideas with CSS in mind, yet.
I completed the move to css when Mozilla 1.0 was released (started using css with the release of Phoenix 0.5), and haven't looked back. The key is to remember that css does not control or limit the design, it is a tool to implement the design. Simply sketch out your desgn and mark up your content with html. Now block out the major groups, wrap them in divs and write the positioning css. The rest is detail. Always think in terms of flow. That is the zen of css-p. cheers, gary
I was a little behind our friend Gary. I started to really grok CSS and semantic validity around the time Firebird emerged. For those of you who aren't aware of the progression, Phoenix --> Firebird --> Firefox. CSS is much more intuitive than tables for layout purposes (you'd still use tables to display tabular data, of course). It may require more of a learning curve than tables, but it eliminates the false dependency between objects that tables inherently force on a layout. Oh, you want this one object to be 15 pixels larger than it is now? Well then, your other 15 table cells are going to pop open 15 pixels larger too! Erm...
I've been working with CSS actively for a year now, but did my first web page using CSS styling in 2001. I think in CSS, can support any modern browser but there's always stuff to learn. CSS3 is so powerful. It will remove much extra markup in web pages. Less extraneous divs and classes. More pseudo-class and attribute selectors. One thing I dislike about CSS is the box model. I rather the IE5 one was used for web pages, which is: Total width = width + margin Rather than how it is: Total width = width + padding + border + margin. I know there's a CSS property that deals with that, but it won't be supported for a long time. The reason is because sometimes it's difficult working out widths and heights on a total page due to padding, margin, width and border values.
You haven't given up the table cell approach. Picture a box {width: 50px; padding: 25px; border: 10px solid blue;}. Now tell me about the content under each box model. There are times when you must get out the H-P rpn programmable scientific calculator to add up the values, but mostly with css, widths take care of themselves. Feel the Flow, Luke. In Firefox, you can use the css3 box-sizing property in its proper proprietary alias, {-moz-box-sizing: border-box;}. cheers, gary
I think my brain is just starting to generate ideas in css - and I attribute it to this forum. I feel as though I've just broken through a barrier after at least a year of sheer fear. BUT ... Thanks to the amazing generosity of the css smartasses around this forum - I'm actually working out some successful css, all by myself. ... THANKYOU smartasses xxx
I started working on website stuff in 2003, and tables were all I was exposed to. In the first half of 2004 I learned about non-table layouts and then made my first design without them. I (and every CSS designer, I'm sure) still know how to use tables -- properly as well as for layouts -- but I generally avoid them. I feel that designing with semantics in mind is much easier.
I'm still new to web designing..got used to css after i wap working on a project for school..just 6 months back..still learning
Yeah, it would cause some sort of reality inversion in your situation, but I'd still rather it be. I live with my calculator when it comes to alignment and the 'MeasureIt' extension is great when you're first measuring up sites that need 'code pressing' (xhtml/css conversions).
I think it's going to be an ongoing exercise. One day css will be replaced with xxx ? It's a big money making merry go round. After all, where would commerce be, if it wasn't for the shifting of goal posts on an all too regular basis? I love the idea of easy access to web information for people with physical difficulties, but how much is this costing them? I know for a fact that the majority of disabled people in my country, don't have access to the software anyway! They are disabled, they can't work, and consequently can't afford the fuck*ing software anyway. A big fat pile of bull. Edit - Apologies for the rant, I'm a little uptight at the mo.
I started learning CSS for more than just fonts in 2005. I'm not at a level of 'zen', but on the other hand, have come a long way.