There is No Clash of Civilizations ...

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by Will.Spencer, Oct 6, 2006.

  1. #1
    A very interesting video is available on MEMRI. The video was originally aired on Al Jazeera.

    See the video at: Arab-American Psychiatrist Wafa Sultan: There is No Clash of Civilizations but a Clash between the Mentality of the Middle Ages and That of the 21st Century

    Background information and a transcript are available at Attacks on Arab-American Psychiatrist Wafa Sultan: Islamist Sheikh on Al-Jazeera Calls Her Heretic; Syrian Sermon Calls Her Infidel.

    A couple of quotes from the video:

    Wafa Sultan: "The clash we are witnessing around the world is not a clash of religions, or a clash of civilizations. It is a clash between two opposites, between two eras. It is a clash between a mentality that belongs to the Middle Ages and another mentality that belongs to the 21st century. It is a clash between civilization and backwardness, between the civilized and the primitive, between barbarity and rationality. It is a clash between freedom and oppression, between democracy and dictatorship. It is a clash between human rights, on the one hand, and the violation of these rights, on other hand. It is a clash between those who treat women like beasts, and those who treat them like human beings. What we see today is not a clash of civilizations. Civilizations do not clash, but compete."

    Dr. Ibrahim Al-Khouli: "If you are a heretic, there is no point in rebuking you, since you have blasphemed against Islam, the Prophet, and the Koran..."
     
    Will.Spencer, Oct 6, 2006 IP
  2. lorien1973

    lorien1973 Notable Member

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    #2
    That is a great video. Memri has some good stuff on it.
     
    lorien1973, Oct 6, 2006 IP
  3. GTech

    GTech Rob Jones for President!

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    #3
    Excellent video. Wafa Sultan sure lays the smackdown on these islamists. I'm sure menji approves too :D
     
    GTech, Oct 6, 2006 IP
  4. Ibn Juferi

    Ibn Juferi Prominent Member

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    #4
    Lame just gets lamer....

    This was discussed here:
    http://www.menj.org/2006/10/05/wafa-sultan-got-owned/

    Here is the full transcript of the video (including the parts which MEMRI did not want you to see):
    http://www.aqoul.com/archives/2006/03/aljazeera_trans.php

    Here is the translated transcript in PDF:
    http://aqoul.com/images/wafa_sultan.pdf

    Yawn. Some people....and the good Doctor called Wafa Sultan a mulhidah (atheist), not a murtaddah (heretic), as MEMRI erroneously translated. So as far as the Doctor was concerned, Wafa Sultan could have been an atheist who was formerly a Christian and he would not have cared less.

    Hence the proper translation of the Doctor's phrase should be:

    "If you are an atheist, there is no point in censoring you if you curse Islam, Islam's Prophet, and Islam's Quran"

    Compare that with the erroneous translation MEMRI produced.

    - MENJ
     
    Ibn Juferi, Oct 7, 2006 IP
  5. Ibn Juferi

    Ibn Juferi Prominent Member

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    #5
    Sure, go ahead and swallow the propaganda MEMRI feeds you with. Fortunately I do know some Arabic so I am not as dumb as you are, monolingual :D

    - MENJ
     
    Ibn Juferi, Oct 7, 2006 IP
  6. Cyrus255

    Cyrus255 Well-Known Member

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    #6
    Ahh you insult us, but you speak our language. Rather than waste time learning Malay, you've had to learn our language to spread your propaganda. You obviously don't see the efficiency there. You show your bigoted nature merely when you use the monolingual as some sort of stereotype label with which to insult people. People who don't HAVE to learn your language, because you are pressured enough to learn ours. We are the dominators of YOU, because YOU were forced to learn our language. We didn't have to waste our time on yours.

    And I know muslims hate being dominated, since the whole point of Islam is to dominate. Islam means "submission". ISLAM MEANS SUBMISSION. Don't you get that Menj? You're just a muslim, one who submits. You're just a dominated individual.

    Tell me, what is the punishment for apostasy in Islam, that from your blog, I see you have condoned?

    Death!
     
    Cyrus255, Oct 7, 2006 IP
  7. earlpearl

    earlpearl Well-Known Member

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    #7
    This type of idea has been forwarded more than once in a variety of settings.

    Fundamentalist religeons often are steeped in old/ancient thinking. A wierd different type of example are the Amish.

    The deep teaching emphasizes forgiveness/forgiveness/forgiveness rather than revenge.

    So after a maniac killed young girls the deeply religeous and trained Amish IMMEDIATELY turned to forgiveness for the killer and his family.

    But so many other fundamentalist religeons depend on writings from ancient times that emphasize killing/etc. and isolation. Isolation from foreign religeons was a requirement back in the day.

    fundamentalist religeons go hand in hand with rejecting modernism.

    So it is a logical description of what is going on.
     
    earlpearl, Oct 7, 2006 IP
  8. Cyrus255

    Cyrus255 Well-Known Member

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    #8
    Odd we're in agreement.

    But most of society, including the President, won't admit that it is Islamic FUNDAMENTALISM, not extremism. To not stone an apostate is EXTREME in Islam.

    It is when Muslims FOLLOW their religion strictly that terrorists are born.

    Osama Bin Laden didn't believe in punching back as a child, but he did believe in the Qu'Ran word for word. When a "radical", strict-interpretationist muslim teacher SHOWED HIM VERSES, commanding death to infidels, Osama took up the cause.

    It'd be like if Christians still followed the old testament and stoned adulterers like Islam does, they chained a girl to the ground in a stadium in Nigeria and stoned her to death just the other day for adultery.

    Christianity however, has a new testament that says the old laws are dead and forgiveness is in.

    Islam, on the other hand, HAS NO NEW TESTAMENT OF FORGIVENESS. Mohammad came and slaughtered entire cities and peoples like the meccans. Whether or not you think it was justified, his nature was violence. His commands were violent. Stonings, beheadings, the modern day Islam is the same Islam from 1300 years ago. NOTHING HAS CHANGED. They still call us crusaders, and they talk about the crusades like they happened yesterday.

    Modern day terrorists are just a modern day descendant of assasins, the word comes from arabs who used to smoke hashish then suicidally attack crusaders. Suicide attacks are 1300 years old in Islam. They hate life. It is a religion that worships death. Martyrs are the highest saints in their religion.

    There is the difference.
     
    Cyrus255, Oct 7, 2006 IP
  9. Grafstein

    Grafstein Peon

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    #9
    fantastic news,shows atleast one muslim had woken up and smelt the coffee.

     
    Grafstein, Oct 7, 2006 IP
  10. Ibn Juferi

    Ibn Juferi Prominent Member

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    #10
    English is the language I speak at home.


    Submission to God, with the intention of peace. That is the full meaning of the word Islam.

    - MENJ
     
    Ibn Juferi, Oct 7, 2006 IP
  11. Ibn Juferi

    Ibn Juferi Prominent Member

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    #11
    She is not even a Muslim, sheis an atheist who was probably a former Xtian.

    - MENJ
     
    Ibn Juferi, Oct 7, 2006 IP
  12. Will.Spencer

    Will.Spencer NetBuilder

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    #12
    What a ridiculously silly thing to say. Do you read anything other than the Koran?

    Wafa says she was shocked into secularism by the 1979 atrocities committed by the Muslim Brotherhood against innocent Syrian people, including the machine-gun assassination of her professor in her classroom in front of her eyes at the University of Aleppo where she was a medical student. "They shot hundreds of bullets into him, shouting, 'God is great!' " she said. "At that point, I lost my trust in their god and began to question all our teachings. It was the turning point of my life, and it has led me to this present point. I had to leave. I had to look for another god."
     
    Will.Spencer, Oct 7, 2006 IP
  13. Ibn Juferi

    Ibn Juferi Prominent Member

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    #13
    And you cooked this up out of thin air? Not even the official transcript mentions this.

    - MENJ
     
    Ibn Juferi, Oct 8, 2006 IP
  14. Ibn Juferi

    Ibn Juferi Prominent Member

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    #14
    Actually I do read the Bible, the Chumash, the Talmud, assorted material on comparative religion and, of course, programming and computing books. I also happen to have a good collection of fiction books as well.

    And to take you to task for this silly lie, here is a glimpse in just over 30% of books in my personal library.

    [​IMG]

    - MENJ
     
    Ibn Juferi, Oct 8, 2006 IP
  15. Will.Spencer

    Will.Spencer NetBuilder

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    #15
    Don't be the slow kid. There are many sources on this brave lady that are not related to this single Al Jazeera interview.

    AND CLEAN UP YOUR ROOM!
     
    Will.Spencer, Oct 8, 2006 IP
  16. Arnie

    Arnie Well-Known Member

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    #16
    Worth while for not to have this burried :)
    Great find, realistic observance ...
     
    Arnie, Oct 8, 2006 IP
  17. Ibn Juferi

    Ibn Juferi Prominent Member

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    #17
    Yeah, your usual pro-Christian Zionist right-wing sources.

    Nope, I like it the way it is. Just to show you that your allegations are false.

    - MENJ
     
    Ibn Juferi, Oct 8, 2006 IP
  18. Will.Spencer

    Will.Spencer NetBuilder

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    #18
    Yep, Wikipedia is run by the Jewish mafia! And they are all out to get you! :rolleyes:


    You showed a picture of books. That doesn't mean that you actually read and understand them.

    The reading comprehension skills you display here are extremely poor.

    How old were you when your parents moved you from dar al-harb to dar al-islam?
     
    Will.Spencer, Oct 8, 2006 IP
  19. Ibn Juferi

    Ibn Juferi Prominent Member

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    #19
    Did not see a link to Wikipedia either!

    Rest assured that I have read all of them.

    - MENJ
     
    Ibn Juferi, Oct 8, 2006 IP
  20. britishguy

    britishguy Prominent Member

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    #20
    What did the content of the books contain ......................................
    ..............................................
    ...............................................................................................
    ....................................................................................................
    ............................................................................
    Nothing I guess just blank pages surely blank pages are knowledge:eek:
     
    britishguy, Oct 8, 2006 IP