Putting a ceiling on how many kids one can have is one of the worst abuse of Human rights. Universal Declaration of Human Rights recognizes Reproductive rights as an important subset of Human rights. Its okay to encourage having less children by giving tax concessions or other sops but a Talibani order is a non-no. Another major demerit of population control is the increase in the average age of citizens leading to an increase in unproductive population and thus a greater demand for Social security measures. China will have to deal with that in a couple of decades. IMO demerits of over population are a myth. What we need is a cheaper and environment friendly energy source and a development of a culture for environment conservation. With all that we can accommodate even 100 billion people. According to some calculations China's entire population can be housed in Beijing if you built nothing but houses in the entire city. Resources are the real problem, not space. But then there's a lot of iron ore on mars and helium on moon and more resources then we can ever imagine in our galaxy. Advancement in Science can solve all problems. I also agree that education and wealth creation will automatically stabilize population. We just need to attract more foreign investment and increase our trade surplus and ensure equal distribution of the said wealth. With this we'll be able to bring the poor into the middle class, now suddenly they won't be getting welfare benefits and pressures of living in a consumerist class will force them to have less children. Problem Solved. Development of Economy, Advancement of Science - Happy world.
Ahh guys I wasn't suggesting some wako martial law to limit the population growth . Like Helvetii said there are measures like a huge taxes , eliminating the 1st born cash grant , better sexual education . I was talking about that type of stuff not something that steps on someones freedom .
for population growth, the reasons are enormous, the educated have already started implementing the same where are the fundamentalists and crazy retards they are aiming for more children, recently I saw an article in some AP news channel about a couple who are damn poor, earning less than $2 a day, they have 11 kids, they are trying for 12th, not for completing a dozen but to have a boy, all the earlier 11 are girls, and the top of all they want govt. to help them feed their kids They seem to assume, they are doing some good will for the govt. by increasing the population growth. This is one extreme of the population, where to have a boy they wouldn't mind go on giving birth after birth, there is another category who kill all the girls on birth they want only boys, as they could bring dowry when they grow old and look after the parents. This is an extreme which we are fighting real hard at the moment, the girl infants death ratio has decreased to an large extent because of the large scale govt. policies. Now, there are other fundamentalists, like islam and hindus.. According to islam fundamentalists, the higher no.of children u have the bigger u r improving the religion, which actually kicks off hindu right wing groups recently they giving cry like give more birth to children else India would turn into an Islam nation, I think Brahmana posted this topic too, as he is one among the right wing group supporters. now, about how to implement strict rules, is a quite an exhausting topic In 80's, the then India Pm's son Sanjay Gandhi, started forced family planning operations mainly in the slum areas, which actually reflected in govt.'s loss in the next election, as this process was widely mis-used. So, this ain't a easy one to digest. The best way to go is, have doctors and medical camps regularly in the slum sectors educating them the importance of having not more than 1 r 2, constant govt. monitoring of the policies and special incentives to the family planning doctors, which would promote them to be more active in educating the un-educated... its just a basic step to go, not a single step policy
Thanks for the heads up masterrio .The problem is a huge one indeed . From my point of view India's overpopulation problem ranks on the 4th place on the major world problems list . It kind of hard for me to understand this . I mean I work day and night sometimes in 72 hour shifts so mu future kids would have everything they need to be happy . I can't empathize whit the man/woman that brings a child in a world of misery . What gives you the fuking right to bring that innocent child into a family that won't offer him even a decent home ? I understand that you want to have children but I think you would be better off working hard to bring up two beautiful children in semi-decent conditions then an army of kids that live in brutal poverty . It's funny that the Indian government praises itself whit all sort of educating projects but it's incapable of providing even the most basic education to the people . I don't know if you guys will manage to solve this issue but no one wants to see a social meltdown in India . Also Helvetti : Ya helium from the moon and popsicles from the sun right ? You know 50 years ago they where thinking that in the 90s we will all have flying cars and moon bases . Quit it whit the science trolling . You're a smart ass . I would really like to see your opinion .
It seems like a more fair and balanced population control strategy would be to give the S.A.T. tests to every person when they turn 18 -- and execute the bottom 10%. That surely would make studying popular and cut down on underaged drinking. * And no, I'm not talking about implementing this in India.
Do you guys think that this population huge growth should be stabilized ? What actions should the government take ? Do we think it should be stabilized? Hope you are not joking. Answering the second part of your question isn't a simple thing. It must be implied on millions of people, there are so many complexities and so on and there is always the untold execution troubles. The last time (1975-77) the administration tried imposing one baby family regulation, it met with big road blocks. But the points that of interest for me to answer your comments on are not these. Why? Particularly when every child in this world knows for sure that pakistan will bomb us the first day we drop our nukes. Not just that, everyone (including the US and EU) is strong in its understanding that bombs in India aren't for blowing up Pakistan. (You know it, it's for the same reason as the US or UK bombs) NATO will side with Pakistan and will certainly be against us. What made you think that NATO will ever take on Pakistan? After all, what is NATO if it's not a self serving, self centered military that fights islam in the open but helps it on the other. We saw what US does (which is the de facto complete NATO) to India, we don't need to be told about its trust worthiness. (If you are a part of NATO you would know this.) Read this wikipedia article on how US goes against its so called ally See what Pakistan is doing to India for ages shutting US's mouth Population, toilets, corruption, all fine but what if you can't live to see a good day at all?
No one said it would be easy . Solving this type of problem will take 10 to 20 years but if left unchecked you are staring in face of a disastrous economic and social meltdown . Also you have misquoted me . If you look at my post you see that I've said that India will have to give up the nukes only after Pakistan renounces it's nuclear capability . As for Nixon's action well his known for not taking some the best decisions in some cased . But The times have changed . 20 years ago Germany was divided and the EU was a way for saying that Western Europe sticks together more of a economic pact between the NATO allies . Today EU is an emerging superpower and NATO has changed it objective from being ready to fight the USSR to defending it's members against any potential military attack . Also NATO now acts like the UN's sword when push came to shove in Kuwait the NATO forces where on the frontline deploying the most advance techs we had . The latest sanction imposed on Iran will soon start to show their effect . Pakistan & Iran are the final bastions where the terrorist have the freedom to roam . If it wasn't for the economic crisis we would have taken even more action . Extermination is not something India should fear . Also what does your avatar represent Alevoor ?
Nothing. I am going to revert it to the original one later. Also, this isn't something US should fear, neither Russia nor EU. Still, Us went on an 8 year war achieving nothing. Well, when a single bomb can wreck havoc, we should not be debating extermination. Just that we don't want more trouble here. It's utterly meaningless of your US, NATO and EU to have started warring on Iraq, Iran et all when the real danger is in Pakistan. Tell me which other muslim country has a nuke and which amongst them has been raised in military regime for decades. However you look at it, Iraq's invasion of Kuwait was a far pettier issue than tackling Pakistan, yet US has Pak on its side in its war against terror leaving the rest of us here bemuse at US' actual intentions. At least, let me understand the rational behind US' energetic help to Kuwait when all it did to help Tibet in pretty much the same circumstance was divine nothing? Why? Aside of it all, why do you think India should renounce nukes, first or second, after all? Let's see if US or NATO has really changed in these years. Apocalypse, it's not easier understanding the political preferences of US sitting here particularly at a time when what you hear and see from it are starkly different. I am not still calling US a two-timer but it certainly is an opportunist and its actions self destructive. There has been no war against terror as it cried hoarse after 9/11 but war for other reasons. I pity the ordinary Americans who have footed the war bills and are now being led to think that Bangalore is bigger demon which earns peanuts against $700-800 bns spent on war against Osama Bin Laden whose present whereabouts US is not ready to accept. Let's not live in assumptions, Apocalypse. You wouldn't probably have taken any action against the final bastions for terrorists, if I go by your history, your strategic interests and commercial interests. And I wouldn't take the theories of the economic crisis preventing you form taking even more action seriously. They are at best, nothing more than rehashed lofty claims.
I am still not sure whether we can include central Asian muslim countries (splinter USSR countries.) But I pretty well remember Pakis distributing millions of quran free of cost to them immediately following their balkanization
True, there is a lot of weirdness brewing in Stanland that is not being monitored by anyone from the civilized world.
Indian govt. hasn't really failed at providing basic education but its the society that has turned into blockade, I have come across people who feel education is worthless, some who feel letting a girl study is a waste of money, NGO's have to step up the gear to get the things right, there are already many packages by the govt. such as free food for children, some govts. even give kids cash for attending school, its not that govt. isn't doing anything but its the corrupted who have become the nuisance I wouldn't agree with India dropping nukes, as India hasn't built up nukes secretly with the help of some friendly nation like pakistan did with china, we are truthful with out works and we have kept our international promises. There has been pressure to the govt. to carry out further nuke tests but the govt. has denied no more are reqd. as earlier ones were successful - so India kept its promise despite pressure at home. We aren't gonna launch any nukes on others and we don't need to. Its pakistan's ploy look at them, they can't take care of their own ones, but look at the way they spend the cash to army and ISI. Pak, is the only country in the world probably which hides its army and intelligence budgets. You can't expect India drop nukes with such a pessimist nation in the neighborhood. We developed nukes for electricity purpose, we have promised for nations to check out our reactors if they have any doubts. case rested
Africa doesn't hold any immediate danger . It will take them another two decades before they have the infrastructure necessary to develop a potent military force . Funny thing that the best safeguard against terrorism is Christianity . While there are a lot of Christian wackos none have pulled any suicide bombing or decapitated in the name of Christ . It would appear the a religion of mercy is the barrier against Islamic terrorism . Anyway that was just a ramble , I just think that the atheist on this forums are gunning to much against Christianity but hey you have the right to do it Now Alevoor I agree that for India Pakistan is the "big devil" since they're the guys pointing nukes at you . The thing is NATO (US & EU) treats threats by location . The pakis can't nuke us so they're not an immediate threat . The agencies are crawling though that place and the smart dictator ass Pervert Mushi is gone . We see that as a huge change . I don't know what will do about Pakistan . I honestly don't know . Maybe they'll change and go full blown democracy . The war in Afghanistan was in many ways a necessity . Before the strike people thought that if you live in a remote corner of the world no one can reach you . Well al Queda never expected to get their asses shot by the Delta Force itself . The talibans expected 70 cruise missiles not armored columns . Thanks to that since 2005 there have been no more lives lost to al Queda in the EU or in the US . Iraq well Iraq was initially a misguided US strike . But atm Iraq might become a center of stability . Of course it also secures cheap oil for the fat Yaquis j/k . And it provides a great strike base against Iran which might be capable of launching a dirty bomb against Europe . If that happens it will get ugly real fast worldwide . We're all nice and cuddly until you hit us . No one wants to see that happening . You asked why we didn't do the same for Tibet ? Simple because at the moment China has the US sucking on it's financial cock . It also holds monopoly on the exports of rare earths . China's evil machine is at the moment out of the question . Still the currency wars have just begun . We'll have to wait and see how it will turn out . The economic crisis is quite a pain like it or not . While a government can send in troops and operatives as they see fit they can't really do that when the population doesn't have a place to work in . You can't shoot missiles worth a million each when your cousin is living on welfare . It's unpractical . Also you mentioned Bangalore . What's the deal whit it ?
Pakistan is just a little more than a big pain in the ass, not just for India but for all. Leave that aside and tell me who wasn't a dictator in Pakistan? And the huge change you are seeing there is a big illusion; it makes me laugh at the west which believes Pakis and takes them on the face value. Do you think this Zardari wouldn't be a dictator if he could have his way? His wife was another figure who declared that she was prepared to wage a 1000 years war against India. In addition, you don't know of their other rulers. The point now, is not whether Mush was a dictator and whether his exit led to democratization there but the whole Pak is a ticking nuclear bomb which is a zillion times dangerous than Al qaeda and Taliban, Iraq and Iran put together. Ironically, you are just towing the much abused official lines like democracy in Pakistan will do wonders, or they will prosper. As for your paragraphs 3,4, and 5, the only thing I say is you have grown up in a different circumstance which is making you see green in red. Here, we make fun of this temperament as Superman temperament. Have you been reading comics too much? Bangalore-Buffalo stories http://business.rediff.com/report/2009/may/05/bpo-say-no-to-bangalore-says-obama.htm http://www.expressindia.com/latest-news/US-firms-against-Obamas-Bangalore-Buffalo-rhetoric/473598/ http://www.ciol.com/News/News-Reports/Bangalore-to-Buffalo-politics-or-economics/5509119256/0/
QFT. This thread is hilarious. ROFL at monkey gods & pregnant fish- and their ardent proponents coming out of the woodworks to "stop the shit flinging". The myths right now are the mystical advancement & energy sources you seek. 100 billion? Even if they can be sustained I can't imagine why that is at all desirable... This is seriously an excellent strategy & something I've been advocating for quite some time. As well as fitness & financial scores. An initial execution rate of the lower 50% is necessary.
Can you come again, so that I can try to stop the shit flinging? If that was just a passing comment, it's fine. But look at your backyard before taking potshots at me. You have enough to answer there. I have heard of flying gods and angels that also look like human birds that have got to do with other faiths. God has once told king solomon to use his flying carpet. . There is also a story of Prince Hossain and his magic carpet. In order that I make the best of my time, I let you google it out for your won self. By the way, who said there is a monkey god?
To both of you: If I had met you in the stone age and said that there is something called iron ore deep below the ground and we can dig it out and mold it into strong weapons, you'd have laughed at me and called it "trolling" or a "myth". If I had met you in the dark ages and said that there's going to be something called a color television then you'd have rolled on the floor laughing. Now its in every house, even the below poverty line ones. People like you underestimate the potential of developing technology. Technology is growing and most importantly, growing at an increasing rate. The bold part is important. It took thousands of years to move from stone to iron tools but only 50-70 years since people dying in smallpox epidemics to being able to do heart transplants with high success rate. Regarding moon bases in the 90's, it would have been easily possible. Its just that the costs exceeded the utility they provided at that time in a few years when the costs of technology are less and people see the utility of having bases on the moon it'll happen. Tell me how many years did it take between US sending a man in space and it sending a man on the moon using the technology of that time? Not many when compared to the time its taking for China to do the same using todays advanced technology. Its not that China can't do it, If they want they can send a man on moon in 5 years, even India can. But these countries can't justify the costs of doing it when compared to the utility. At the time of the cold war US and Russia were competing in space technology which released huge funds for space missions with the only utility of being one step ahead of the other superpower and public sentiment. Advancement in Science is a reality you all have to deal with, we have come a long way from making coal based power plants to much more cleaner and efficient nuclear power plants. Do you know how much power can be created out of 1kg nuclear material compared to 1 kg coal? There is NO reason to believe why we can't find something even more better. Nuclear fusion which powers the sun and stars is many times more efficient and a totally clean source of energy, what more theres enough helium on the moon to power the earth for centuries using absolutely clean fuel. The technology is already there, it just needs to be controlled and many countries are researching it together but look at the funding the projects got, I'd bet Cocacola and pepsi put more into their R&D. I guess it would not be before oil reaches 500$ that some serious funding will go into it. Regarding why 100 billion is desirable there are variety of reasons, most importantly the instinct to grow your species. If we can sustain it why not? I imagine a time when 100's of billions of homo-sapiens and related species would crowd the universe living on a variety of planets and I think its desirable. Yeah I know its funny. There isn't? Hanuman? You know the one Obama carries as his goodluck charm, the one who burnt an entire city with his ass on fire? Please don't act dumb