Yea, that's you and that shows what you are You curse, but I keep my level high and don't talk like you. You know what? Turkey is not Iraq or Afghanistan, you get your asses kicked here, just try..
It looks like that turkey will never make it into the EU now. They don't want to seperate religion from state which is one among other requirements. The pope has made some remarks too recently which is causing uproar in the muslim world. Why do muslims seperate themselves? What will be the outcome with iran? - Buying time or will they become serious and to finally develop its nation the way it works? islam is a headache that's for sure. Instead of fully accepting the grace of God ,they try hard to stay seperated. Who you think is going to come to your rescue if you guys continue like this. Muslims!!! Got it? You're not under Gods Grace, and his grace is the only thing that can save you.
Brother SunLove yes there were slaves whose masters were nonmuslims and muslims because they were slaves by choice not by chance and noone captured slaves in chains like the american did.(Prophet Muhammad(PBUH) was never ok with slaves) But it was only Islam that faught slavery and set slaves free because 1)Islam gave permission for people to free there slaves if slave wants freedom from master 2)Prophet Muhammad also urged wealthy Muslims to buy slaves from the Pagan Arabs and to let them free after that. One of Prophet Muhammad's best friends was a slave from Africa called Bilal Al-Habashi. Bilal was bought from his Pagan master by Abu Baker Al-Siddeek, one of Muhammad's best friends. After Abu Baker bought Bilal, he set him free. 3)Dont lust slave girl for her beauty.If you can deal justly with her marry her and give her respect as you give to your wife. 4)"It is not righteousness that ye turn your faces Towards east or West; but it is righteousness to believe in God and the Last Day, and the Angels, and the Book, and the Messengers; to spend of your substance, out of love for Him, for your kin, for orphans, for the needy, for the wayfarer, for those who ask, and for the ransom of slaves; to be steadfast in prayer, and practice regular charity; to fulfil the contracts which ye have made; and to be firm and patient, in pain (or suffering) and adversity, and throughout all periods of panic. Such are the people of truth, the God-fearing. (The Noble Quran, 2:177)" NOTE:for the ransom of slaves. I think these points are enough to prove muslims freeing of slaves is commanded by Allah. NOTE: It was not prophet Muhammad(PBUH) who was ok with slavery( infact he ordered to buy them and set them free and treat them equally like other people) but it were people that time who were ok being slaves because: 1) When their country or tribe lost the war, they also lost most or all of their money as war booty. Being out of money and food, it becomes necessary for an individual to find the means for basic survival in life. Living as a slave would provide this. 2)Widows, Orphans, and the extremely poor of the enemy side need the financial and social protection from a Master. Back then, there were no governments with good social system that protects everyone. Slavery back then was that social system in special cases. 3) Instead of spending life in prisons people who committed crimes preffered to be slaves as it would save them from 4 walls of prison and grant them some sort of freedom. 4)Diseases,poverty,famine,draughts forced people to be slaves and feed their masters who inturn will provide them with shelter,food,clothing. Thus it proves people themselves were willing to be slaves and it was prophet Muhammad(PBUH) will told to set them free and deal them justly and equally and free them if they wish. Brother SunLove I hope I answered your question.If still you have any doubt Please ask me anything. Now can you give me example where Jesus(PBUH) told 1..ban slavery 2. set the slaves free 3. treat them justly and equally and if they want freedom set them free. You know why people(non muslims) in Arabia hated Islam because rich people did not like to pray shoulder to shoulder with poor people.They thought we are very superior and cant mix with poor,illiterates,slaves. It was prophet Muhammad(PBUH) who told everyone is equal in eyes of God,noone is superior or inferior.When we pray in mosque we set the best example of this as everyone prays together shoulder to shoulder ,be it rich,king,begger,poor,governer or peon.
Before your funny murderous bloodthirsty mohammad there was Moses who killed a guard to save a slave.
And there was also Jesus(PBUH) who ( according to your Bible) told animals have more value than human slaves. Notice however, that in Exodus 21:32, if a bull gores a slave male or female to death, then the bull will only be stoned but not to death. Unlike in Exodus 21:28, the bull will survive. Ha ha .. isnt it funny.
You're pointing to exodus, which points to historical facts for that time and muslim time now. What about the New Testament? - and what about the quran which is based is on the Old Testement and even twisted that too?
Yes this is from New Testament: Timothy 6:1 "All who are under the yoke of slavery should consider their masters worthy of full respect, so that God's name and our teaching may not be slandered." Matthew 10:24 "A student is not greater than the teacher. A slave is not greater than the master." It means Jesus doesn't tell all men are equal. Let us look at 1 Peter 2:18 "Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh." It means slaves had to bear cruelity of harsh masters and to suffer.not say anything. Let us look at Colossians 3:22 "Slaves, obey your earthly masters in everything; and do it, not only when their eye is on you and to win their favor, but with sincerity of heart and reverence for the Lord." It shows for jesus(PBUH) slavery was ok and what about the quran which is based on the Old Testement and even twisted that too Ha ha thats the joke of the day.Holy Quran is Gods book for everyone not for muslims only.It is entirely different than old Testament.
It was not OK but common in this time. Jesus knew that. It wouldn't have made any sense to call for a revolution, lets say like islam style, to stop it, because it would have only caused bloodshed and that is what Jesus always avoided. Slaves translated to this time means workers now, which is in some form slavery too.
What do you mean by Islam style.Ya i know slavery was common then both in times of Jesus(PBUH) and Mohammad(PBUH).You read my posts and see what Prophet Muhammad(PBUH) did to curb slavery.Fourms on this page and fourms on previous page.
Why do you still have slavery in your region then? Remember there are 2 big fairs a year(I don't know the country at the moment, but is a middle eastern muslim country. Those slaves are traded for camels, cash etc...and those slaves have to work it off for years before they will be set free. If there is no buyer then the have to start all over again. Then there are the sex slave trades on the same basis. I remember the two norwegian freighters, hired by muslim slave-traders, that were changes into kind of cruisers, containing 3 - 4000 girls and boys each. This was exposed a couple of years ago.
"Turkey is not Iraq or Afghanistan, you get your asses kicked here, just try.." This ain't football, bro, we aren't playing games... Make certain you never give us a REASON to go to Turkey!!! Tell your bloody fucking arab buddies to keep their stinking Isalm to themselves and fly their planes AWAY from OUR BUILDINGS. If they don't and if YOU ever try it - we WILL kick your ignorant asses back to the seventh century where you belong! Signed: Sick of your shit!!! IN Christ
Go and investigate about Turkey's military power, and investigate our history, the wars we won Remember Çanakkale, we kicked English' ass, we can easily kick yours also And yes, we're not playing game, so your country should be careful.
You seem to have no knowledge of history. I listened to interviews with turkish army generals yesterday, was quite interesting. What do you think will happen next in your country? Will you get a place in the EU or not? What about the growing opposition against the memebership by turkish islamists? Please advice.
Jesus WAS NOT OK with Slavery. May I say that you are MISUNDERSTANDING Christianity. If the masters of the slaves followed: Love each other. Love your neighbor like yourself. Love your enemies. They would free their slaves. It shows again and again that Christianity is a religion of PEACE. Jesus didn't come to swing the sword or bring rebellions. Seems like you don't see the Divine Ideas of NON VIOLANCE. Christianity is a religion of LOVE and Peace. Jesus was not and is not a man of violence like Muhammad. Never waged wars like Muhammad did. Never gave instructions for violance like Muhammad did. How they can they be equal? Jesus sacrificed himself in the name of God, Muhammad sacrificed others in the name of God. May I ask you muslim if Islam is the best of the best, fair and just religion, and claims it treats women fairly and equally, why a woman is required to have FOUR MALE WITNESSES in a court of law? This is not told with symbols from Muhammad. It is told to be understood literally. It is practiced in Pakistan TODAY. http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showt...hlight=sunlove http://news.yahoo.com/s/csm/20060913/wl_csm/ohudood Seems like you are evading the answers of some of my questions you cannot find any kind of answer without contradicting yourself or the Quran. I feel sorry for this guy Willie that is looking for Islam, after being in jail (justly) he couldn't find friends in the Church. IMO if he really changed himself for the better it couldn't be a problem to get a normal life. Seems like he feels himself as outcast. I bet he is not going to find what he really needs in Islam. His mind will get more messed up than it is now. I don't see Islam as giving equal or better than Christianity ideas. My opinion only. Willie if you want to make it in life follow to your best these three commandments: Love each other. Love your neighbor like yourself. Love your enemies. If you truly apply them in your life, there is no way you could fail. People fail only because they don't apply them. sunlove Good Luck, and may God help you.
I have great knowledge of history, believe me. Who wants to get in the EU ? %90 of Turkey don't want it. EU needs our young population, we don't need them.. So I don't care about EU a little bit even.. And probably we won't get into EU because of Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus. Doesn't matter much though..