Jesus In Islam!

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by moq, Aug 24, 2006.

  1. Arnie

    Arnie Well-Known Member

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    #181
    Tolerance and the Qur’an
    Understanding the Unavoidable Islam
    by

    Nezir Hyseni
    (NezirHyseni@hotmail.com)


    A member of the Gideons (an organization which distributes the Bible worldwide) was telling the story of handing out Bibles in the streets of Marseille, a city in France. According to him, the French city of Marseille now claims Islam as the religion of the majority. It was in this city that Muslims who were offered Bibles took them, and either threw them over his head or burned them in front of him. Such an attitude would not be expected from the majority of westerners even if they strongly disagreed with literature distribution and its message.

    With Islam coming to the West through immigration and conversion, it is to be expected that attitudes in the “public square” are going to be affected. The social reality of religious pluralism, where Islam and other religions cannot live in isolation any more, forces us to take seriously the implications of such a plurality of religious views and examine the effects on religious freedom and tolerance. Can Muslims and other religious people live together in peace and harmony? As a student of world religions says: “Frankly, the history of religion is not reassuring.”[1]

    What makes some Muslims behave as they did in the streets of a French city? What leads some Muslims to blow up the World Trade Center towers in an American city, killing thousands of civilians? Is this behavior an expression of true Islam or a perversion of it? What does Islam teach on religious tolerance? These are questions that cannot be answered quickly or easily and yet the answers are there if one looks diligently.
     
    Arnie, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  2. debunked

    debunked Prominent Member

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    #182
    No that isn't written in the bible, it is added by some muslim teacher (liar) who is trying to add to what was there due to the lack of knowledge of the history of that culture - I will help you understand by bolding the lines added by some fraud. And this fraud has a thing about 2 fingers, why 2 fingers might I ask? (only he would know??) These added lines are not part of that culture unlike some muslim cultures.

     
    debunked, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  3. KalvinB

    KalvinB Peon

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    #183
    The test for pedophilia:

    Has the man reached puperty?

    If so, has she reached puberty?

    If not, you're a pedophile. It doesn't matter what the law says.

    http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=pedophile

    The defintion of a pedophile is an adult who is sexually attracted to children.

    Mr M was sick individual who preyed on little girls because he couldn't get a real woman. Men who love and respect women don't make up a religion to oppress them.

    If you were all about love and peace you wouldn't have spouted off personal attacks just because your stupid false prophet was insulted.
     
    KalvinB, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  4. muslim

    muslim Peon

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    #184
    these lines are in Bible only. Now you are not able to bear the truth.Go read it properly and you will find all of this there.

    You guys keep on telling lot about Jihad and terrorism in Islam without knowing the actual meaning of Jihad.

    Can you first explain this then point finger at others religion. Now dont tell this also is not in Bible as I have quoted the page numbers.
    Terrorism in Bible

    1. Jesus(PBUH) himself commanded the killing of Apostates
    It is often believed that the Bible gives absolute religious freedom to everyone. Most of the Christians in the United States and the the West think that the freedom of choice and speech that they have comes originally from the Bible. Let's just see how accurate this myth really is.



    In the Old Testament:

    Let us look at Deuteronomy 13:6-9 "If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying: Let us go and worship other gods (gods that neither you nor your fathers have known, gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other, or gods of other religions), do not yield to him or listen to him. Show him no pity. Do not spare him or shield him. You must certainly put him to death. Your hand must be the first in putting him to death, and then the hands of all the people."

    Also let us look at Deuteronomy 17:3-5 "And he should go and worship other gods and bow down to them or to the sun or the moon or all the army of the heavens, .....and you must stone such one with stones and such one must die."
    This verse was sent by Yusif 65; may Allah Almighty always be pleased with him: 2 Chronicles 15:13 "All who would not seek the LORD, the God of Israel, were to be put to death, whether small or great, man or woman."

    In the New Testament by Jesus and Paul:
    Let us look at what Jesus said in the New Testament in context:

    Matthew 15:1-9
    1 Then some Pharisees and teachers of the law came to Jesus from Jerusalem and asked,
    2 "Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? They don't wash their hands before they eat!"
    3 Jesus replied, "And why do you break the command of God for the sake of your tradition?
    4 For God said, 'Honor your father and mother' and 'Anyone who curses his father or mother must be put to death.'
    5 But you say that if a man says to his father or mother, 'Whatever help you might otherwise have received from me is a gift devoted to God,'
    6he is not to 'honor his father' with it. Thus you nullify the word of God for the sake of your tradition.
    7You hypocrites! Isaiah was right when he prophesied about you:
    8 " 'These people honor me with their lips, but their hearts are far from me.
    9 They worship me in vain; their teachings are but rules taught by men.'"
    There are few points to notice here:

    1- Notice in verse 3, Jesus rebuked the Pharisees for breaking the Commands of GOD Almighty.
    2- In verse 4, he used the cursing of parents' punishment as an example. The context, however, is not limited to just this example!
    3- In verses 7,8 and 9, he used a quote from the book of Isaiah in the Old Testament, to further prove that they are not following the Commands of GOD Almighty.
    4- Jesus clearly had a problem with them not following the punishment of death for cursing the parents or any punishment of death that is commanded in the OT for this matter! In fact, Jesus himself said:

    "Do not think that I [Jesus] have come to abolish the Law (the Old Testament) or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke or a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law (the Old Testament) until everything is accomplished. (Matthew 5:17-18)"
    "Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples: 'The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat. So you must obey them and do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.' (Matthew 23:1-3)"

    This clearly means:
    1- Jesus absolutely approved and commanded the following of the OT's Laws regarding apostates!
    2- The fact he commanded death penalty for cursing the parents clearly proves that he also approves of killing apostates as clearly shown in the OT verses above!

    Paul:

    Let us look at Romans 1:20-32 (from the New Testament) "20. For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
    21. For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened.
    22. Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools
    23. and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.
    24. Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another.
    25. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator--who is forever praised. Amen.
    26. Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones.
    27. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
    28. Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done.
    29. They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips,
    30. slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents;
    31. they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless.
    32. Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them."

    Also psychics must be put to death. Let us look at Leviticus 20:27 "And as for a man or woman in whom there proves to be a mediumistic spirit or spirit of prediction, they should be put to death without fail. They should pelt them to death with stones. Their own blood is upon them."

    The above verses clearly show that the Bible doesn't tolerate apostates. Jesus did honor the Old Testament's laws and ordered his followers to follow the Old Testament until the day of Judgment:

    "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law (the Old Testament) or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke or a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law (the Old Testament) until everything is accomplished. (Matthew 5:17-18)"

    Christians always say as an excuse that an Old Testament law does not apply to them. According to Matthew 5:17-18, we clearly see that Jesus honored the Old Testament, and forced Christians to follow the unmodified laws of it that have not been replaced by newer ones in the New Testament. The Old Testament as we clearly see above orders the immediate killing of apostates/renegades. The New Testament as we also clearly see above, orders the death of the apostates/renegades. And according to Matthew 5:17-18 above, apostates/renegades in Christianity must be put to death simultaneously.

    By the way, please visit: Christians are obligated to follow the Old Testament.


    Also, during the middle centuries when the Church used to rule over everything, the minority Christians and the Christian Scientists were slaughtered and put to death by the majority ones just because the Priests and Ministers of the High Church decided to call as "heresies" or "apostates". The Bible does give clear authority to the Priests and Ministers to call someone an apostate:

    "The spiritual man makes judgments about all things, but he himself is not subject to any man's judgment. (1 Corinthians 2:15)"

    Conclusion:

    The Bible in both the Old and New Testaments command the killing of apostates, and those who disagree need to produce their proofs.

    After all, the Medieval Churches during the middle centuries, who used to persecute minority Christians and Jews, were not deviants after all! They were simply following their bible; the book of women's vaginas and breasts taste like "wine".
     
    muslim, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  5. muslim

    muslim Peon

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    #185
    Terrorism and Pedophilia in the Bible! Killing innocent children and women, and forcing 3-year old slave girls into sex!

    >>>>>The murders of the Bible's Prophets:

    In his list of nonsensical articles, Silas of the "Answering Islam" team, wrote a number of articles inventing lies against Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him while so hypocritically ignoring the same incidents ("murders" as he called them) that happened from the Bible's own Prophets!
    Let us look at few examples of the Biblical Prophets' "murders":

    >>>>Killing of Innocent Children:
    The following verse was sent to me by brother Jibril; may Allah Almighty always be pleased with him.
    2 Kings 2
    23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some youths came out of the town and jeered at him. "Go on up, you baldhead!" they said. "Go on up, you baldhead!"
    24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the LORD . Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the youths.
    Important Note: When Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him tried to migrate from Mecca to the city of Al-Ta'if, the pagans there had their own children throw rocks on the Prophet until his face and body were swollen and bleeding. The Prophet peace be upon him prayed for the people of Al-Ta'if to be Guided to Islam. And ultimately they were Guided and they embraced Islam.
    While Prophet Muhammad loved and forgave children for throwing stones at him, the Bible shows ZERO tolerance to even innocent name-calling from children; let alone having them throwing stones!!

    Numbers 31:17-18
    "Now kill all the boys [innocent kids]. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man."

    According to the historical elaborations about Numbers 31:17-18 Biblical Verses in the Jewish Talmud, the girls in "every girl who has never slept with a man" were AS YOUNG AS 3 YEARS OLD, and were forced into SEX!
    Exodus 13
    14 "In days to come, when your son asks you, 'What does this mean?' say to him, 'With a mighty hand the LORD brought us out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.
    15 When Pharaoh stubbornly refused to let us go, the LORD killed every firstborn in Egypt, both man and animal. This is why I sacrifice to the LORD the first male offspring of every womb and redeem each of my firstborn sons.'
    16 And it will be like a sign on your hand and a symbol on your forehead that the LORD brought us out of Egypt with his mighty hand."
    Allah Almighty Said regarding innocent souls in the Noble Quran:

    "But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in God: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things). (The Noble Quran, 8:61)"

    "Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for God loveth not transgressors. (The Noble Quran, 2:190)"

    "On that account: We ordained for the Children of Israel that if any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people. Then although there came to them Our apostles with clear signs, yet, even after that, many of them continued to commit excesses in the land. (The Noble Quran, 5:32)"

    >>>>>>Murders by Prophets in the Bible:
    Numbers 25
    17 "Treat the Midianites as enemies and kill them,
    18 because they treated you as enemies when they deceived you in the affair of Peor and their sister Cozbi, the daughter of a Midianite leader, the woman who was killed when the plague came as a result of Peor."
    1 Kings 21
    20 Ahab said to Elijah, "So you have found me, my enemy!" "I have found you," he answered, "because you have sold yourself to do evil in the eyes of the LORD.
    21 'I am going to bring disaster on you. I will consume your descendants and cut off from Ahab every last male in Israel-slave or free.
    22 I will make your house like that of Jeroboam son of Nebat and that of Baasha son of Ahijah, because you have provoked me to anger and have caused Israel to sin.'
    2 Kings 9
    7 You are to destroy the house of Ahab your master, and I will avenge the blood of my servants the prophets and the blood of all the LORD's servants shed by Jezebel.
    8 The whole house of Ahab will perish. I will cut off from Ahab every last male in Israel-slave or free.
    9 I will make the house of Ahab like the house of Jeroboam son of Nebat and like the house of Baasha son of Ahijah.
    In 1 Kings 21 and 2 Kings 9, were all "last males" guilty of what the enemies of GOD Almighty did? In other words, did they all have to die for the sins of others?
    >>>>>>>>Killing the Righteous before the wicked:

    Ezekiel 21
    3 and say to her: 'This is what the LORD says: I am against you. I will draw my sword from its scabbard and cut off from you both the righteous and the wicked.
    4 Because I am going to cut off the righteous and the wicked, my sword will be unsheathed against everyone from south to north.
    5 Then all people will know that I the LORD have drawn my sword from its scabbard; it will not return again.'
    We don't see the hypocrites of "answering Islam" complaining about their bible killing the innocent before the guilty, do we?
    I find it to be absolutely ridiculous that the bible feeds us all kinds of lies and contradictions about "love your enemy", and yet, we see mass slaughter of suckling infants and innocent boys, girls, unarmed men, women (old and young), and innocent domestic farm animals by the tens of thousands! It is clear that the inconsistent man-altered, man-corrupted and morally corrupt bible is nothing but a false book, and can not be a Divine and Perfect Holy Book!
    I challenge any Jew or Christian to produce ONE, JUST ONE Noble Verse from the Muslims' Noble Quran that condones killing of innocent children, women or even hostile enemy men who drop their weapons before Muslims (surrender).

    As we've seen above without any doubt, Islam prohibits Muslims from being the aggressors! Muslims are not only commanded to not start any war, but also if war was declared by the enemy and they then incline toward peace, then the Muslims are also Commanded to incline toward peace.

    Pedophilia and killing "suckling infants" in the Bible!
    Ironically, one of the Bible's 10 pillars or ten Commandments says: "Thou shalt not kill. (Exodus 20:13)." Yet, innocent children and non-virgin women were ordered to be killed by the mass, perhaps in thousands! 3-year old slave girls were also ordered to be raped by Moses.

    >>>>Suckling infants were executed by the tens of thousands:

    1 Samuel 15:2-4
    2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember that which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid wait for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.
    3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
    4 And Saul gathered the people together, and numbered them in Telaim, two hundred thousand footmen, and ten thousand men of Judah.


    A praise for dashing little children against rocks as a form of revenge:

    Psalm 137:8-9
    8 O daughter of Babylon, O destroyed one, O the happiness of him who repayeth to thee thy deed, That thou hast done to us.
    9 O the happiness of him who doth seize, And hath dashed thy sucklings on the rock!

    I find it to be absolutely ridiculous that the bible feeds us all kinds of lies and contradictions about "love your enemy", and yet, we see mass slaughter of suckling infants and innocent boys, girls, unarmed men, women (old and young), and innocent domestic farm animals by the tens of thousands! It is clear that the inconsistent man-altered, man-corrupted and morally corrupt bible is nothing but a false book, and can not be a Divine and Perfect Holy Book!

    I challenge any Jew or Christian to produce ONE, JUST ONE Noble Verse from the Muslims' Noble Quran that condones killing of innocent children, women or even hostile enemy men who drop their weapons before Muslims (surrender).

    >>>>>> If you want I will give you lot of examples from Bible which promote terrorism.
     
    muslim, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  6. muslim

    muslim Peon

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    #186
    You guys keep on blaming about our Holy Prophet(PBUH) and his marriage with Aisha.I gave you lots and lots of proofs to prove that their marriage was valid and noone( muslims,Jews,christians) had objection that time but in 21st century u guys have objection.Anyway fools need lot of explination and I will explain you again...

    Age consent in our world today only 100 years ago to girls as young as 10:



    I took this info from the soc.religion.islam newsgroup and it is written by various knowledgeable Muslims informing that the age of consent in the USA was 10 hardly 100 years ago and 11 in the UK, Talmud allowing 3 year olds to get married! etc. :-

    "(And there is evidence that Ayesha was substantially older. That some of our ancient scholars preferred the younger age shows, in fact, that they did not consider marriage at that age to be reprehensible, otherwise they would have preferred the evidence for a later marriage and consummation.)

    At the time the marriage was arranged, Muhammad had not left Makka; he was not the leader of a powerful community; indeed, his life was in danger. I raise this point because it is asserted, sometimes, that, essentially, he could have whatever he wanted. Rather, if this marriage had been an outrage to the community, it would have been *very* harmful to his cause."

    Above comments by Abdulrahman Lomax.

    The age of sexual consent is still quite low in many places. In Japan, people can legally have sex at age 13, and in Spain they can legally have sex at age 12. (This data comes from the Age of Consent chart, which you can see at: http://www.ageofconsent.com/ageofconsent.htm)

    The Prophet's contemporaries (both enemies and friends) clearly accepted the Prophet's marriage to `Aisha without any problem. We see the evidence for this by the lack of criticism against the marriage until modern times. However, a change in culture caused the change in our times today.

    A 40-year-old man having sex with a 14-year-old woman may be a "pedophile" in the USA today, but not in China today (where the age of consent is 14), nor in the USA last century. Biology is a much better standard by which to determine these things in my view, not the arbitrariness of human culture.


    ***** In the USA last century, the age of consent was 10 years old. California was the first state to change the age of consent to 14, which it did in 1889. After California, other US states joined in and raised the age of consent too. (Source: http://www.ageofconsent.com/comments/numberone.htm)

    As for the reasons why we age of consent just seems to get higher and higher, Essentially, we need more education just to survive in today's society, and this takes much more time. This additional education we need to function in today's society seems to me to be the main cause of the increase in the age of consent in many 20th century societies. The Common Law age of consent was 10. The French penal code raised the age from 11 to 13 only a century ago. In England, it was only in 1929 (70 years ago) that the ancient Christian minimum age for the marriage of females, which was 12, was abandoned. The early rock and roll singer Jerry Lee Lewis was considerably older than his 13 cousin whom he married in all legality in Arkansas. Since then, the age there has been raised to 16. That marriage lasted for about 15 years and there was never any other "scandal" associated with Jerry Lee Lewis. The story is quite different, however, for his cousin Jimmy Swaggart (the well-known and disgraced tele-evangelist) who married a woman his own age but later publicly confessed that he was an adulterer and a whoremonger.

    In the seventh century, 3 year old girls were burned to death or tortured in Europe for copulating with demons, witches and sorcerers. Strong sexual passions were attributed to the youngest children. Even Jean Bodin, one of the greatest legal authorities of his time, said that the appropriate age of consent for a female was 6. (I do not mean to suggest that 3 year olds did in fact have sexual relations with demons. It is however interesting to see that at that time it was publicly believed that child-adult relations were the fault of seductive children who sought out mature men rather than today's popular belief that it is instead pedophiliac adults who prey on innocent, unsuspecting children.)

    In the US (an example of a prominent western country, since the west had the greatest effect on the world in the last couple of centuries.) They considered a seven year old female competent on making decisions regarding sex, though it was raised later on (in 1886, after attempts to raise the age of consent, Delaware was the only state to retain the common law age of seven, while twenty five states set the minimum age at a mere ten.) In older times, children were not perceived in the same sense that we perceive them, but the perception was changed gradually, which is due to a great extent to industrialization, and of course sigmund freud and others came along with their theories and supported these changes in social thinking.
     
    muslim, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  7. KalvinB

    KalvinB Peon

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    #187
    "historical inference" that they were as young as 3. hardly proof and definitly not implied by the Bible. Claiming Moses ordered the rape of 3 year olds is just another indication that you are incapable of honest debate. God had told them to kill everyone and that order was violated when they saved some of the women.

    The kids were killed because they insulted God. Not because they insulted the prophet. The fact they were killed by a bear should have been a huge clue that God was obviously behind their death.

    No one was ordered to kill those kids.

    I'm pretty sure at the time of the flood not everyone was male and above the age of 18.

    God must be a real jerk for killing off infants, women and children. But, then again, you claim to believe in the same God so I guess there's no point arguing about that.

    No one is arguing that God never ordered the complete and utter destruction of a people. The argument is that he doesn't place such destruction in the hands of just anyone. Those orders came down through real prophets who could prove God gave them the word and were directed to specific armies for a specific battle.

    Your prophet is still a pedophile by definition. And you have yet to prove he was divinly guided.

    There's nothing in the Koran that the devil wouldn't have known. Even the devil knows what shape the earth is. I have yet to see real prophecy. Only God can see the future.
     
    KalvinB, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  8. KalvinB

    KalvinB Peon

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    #188
    Oh yeah, thanks for illustrating the Bible has no qualms about detailing the sins of those who God called to serve him.

    It once again demonstrates how rediculous it is that you can't admit your alledged prophet wasn't perfect and may in fact have committed some serious sins.

    So now, about those prophecies your alledged prophet spoke. What are they, which came true and which didn't?
     
    KalvinB, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  9. debunked

    debunked Prominent Member

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    #189
    Muslim, stop with the cut and paste, all the items you are trying to use to compare,etc or tell Christians what to do or believe are just off. Since you are just copy/pasting these things it shows your lack of research and understanding even when debunked. I don't feel anyone should just keep debunking the items that you don't even understand since you never researched them yourself. So I will not waste my time trying to explain to you the obvious in so many verses that satan is trying to twist.
     
    debunked, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  10. muslim

    muslim Peon

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    #190
    What I told was all in Bible.Instead of doing resarch on it and finding the truth you will write your own stuff to prove you are right.It is because you yourself are ashamed of Bible and your religion.Can you believe one christian told me that bible has 20000 errors.All you know is to blame others religion but first investigate yours.

    Yes I copy pasted articles from resources which I researched myself.I have given you name of books and its pages so you can easily find where it is writtten.When you cant defend something you will tell that thing does not exist or it is false. grow up brothers and see the reality.Most of these articles have been sent by non muslims only which clearly explains every thing.
     
    muslim, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  11. muslim

    muslim Peon

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    #191
    Miracles and divine magnitude performed by prophet Muhammad(PBUH)

    1.Splitting of the Moon

    One of the times when God performed miracles at the hand of the Prophet was when the Meccans demanded to see a miracle from Muhammad to show his truthfulness. God split the moon in two separate halves and then re-joined them. The Quran recorded the event:

    “The Last Hour draws near, and the moon is split asunder!” (Quran 54:1)

    Prophet Muhammad would recite these verses of the Quran in large congregations of the weekly Friday prayer and the bi-annual Eed prayers.[1] Had the event never occurred, Muslims themselves would have doubted their religion and many would have left it! The Meccans would have said, ‘Hey, your prophet is a liar, the moon never split, and we never saw it split!’ Instead, the believers grew stronger in their faith and the only explanation the Meccans could come up with was, ‘passing magic!’

    “The Last Hour draws near, and the moon is split asunder! And if they see a sign (miracle), they turn away and say, ‘Passing magic!’- for they are bent on giving it the lie, being always wont to follow their own desires.” (Quran 54:1-3)

    The splitting of the moon is confirmed through eye-witness testimony transmitted through an unbroken chain of reliable scholars so many that is it impossible that it could be false (hadith mutawatir).[2]

    A skeptic might ask, do we have any independent historical evidence to suggest the moon was ever split? After all, people around the world should have seen this marvelous event and recorded it.
    The answer to this question is twofold.

    First, people around the world could not have seen it as it would have been daytime, late night, or early morning many parts of the world. The following table will give the reader some idea of corresponding world times to 9:00 pm Mecca time:

    Country
    Time
    Mecca 9:00 pm

    India 11:30 pm
    Perth 2:00 am
    Reykjavik 6:00 pm
    Washington D.C. 2:00 pm
    Rio de Janeiro 3:00 pm
    Tokyo 3:00 am
    Beijing 2:00 am

    Also, it is not likely that a large number of people in lands close by would be observing the moon at the exact same time. They had no reason to. Even if some one did, it does not necessarily mean people believed him and kept a written record of it, especially when many civilizations at that time did not preserve their own history in writing.

    Second, we actually have an independent, and quite amazing, historical corroboration of the event from an Indian king of that time.

    Kerala is a state of India. The state stretches for 360 miles (580 kilometers) along the Malabar Coast on the southwestern side of the Indian peninsula.[3] King Chakrawati Farmas of Malabar was a Chera king, Cheraman perumal of Kodungallure. He is recorded to have seen the moon split. The incident is documented in a manuscript kept at the India Office Library, London, reference number: Arabic, 2807, 152-173.[4] A group of Muslim merchant’s passing by Malabar on their way to China spoke to the king about how God had supported the Arabian prophet with the miracle of splitting of the moon. The shocked king said he had seen it with his own eyes as well, deputized his son, and left for Arabia to meet the Prophet in person. The Malabari king met the Prophet, bore the two testimonies of faith, learned the basics of faith.

    It is said that the contingent was led by a Muslim, Malik bin Dinar, and continued to Kodungallure, the Chera capital, and built the first, and India’s oldest, mosque in the area in 629 CE which exists today.
    The news of his accepting Islam reached Kerala where people accepted Islam. The people of Lakshadweep and the Moplas (Mapillais) from the Calicut province of Kerala are converts from those days.

    The Indian sighting and the meeting of the Indian king with Prophet Muhammad is also reported by Muslim sources. The famous Muslim historian, Ibn Kahtir, mentions the splitting of the moon was reported in parts of India.[6] Also, the books of hadith have documented the arrival of the Indian king and his meeting the Prophet. Abu Sa’id al-Khudri, a companion of Prophet Muhammad, states:

    “The Indian king gifted the Prophet with a jar of ginger. The companions ate it piece by piece. I took a bite as well.”[7]
    The king was thus considered a ‘companion’ – a term used for a person who met the Prophet and died as a Muslim – his name registered in the mega-compendiums chronicling the Prophet’s companions.[8]

    There are many other miracles which the Prophet performed related in the Sunnah, or conglomeration of the sayings ,deeds, approvals, and descriptions of the Prophet.

    The Tree Trunk

    In Medina Muhammad used to deliver sermons leaning on a tree stump. When the number of worshippers increased, someone suggested a pulpit be built so he can use it to deliver the sermon. When the pulpit was built, he abandoned the tree trunk. Abdullah ibn Umar, one of the companions, gave an eye-witness testimony of what happened. The trunk was heard weeping, the Prophet of Mercy went towards it and comforted it with his hand.[1]

    The event is also confirmed through eye-witness testimony transmitted through the ages with an unbroken chain of reliable scholars (hadith mutawatir).[2]

    The Flowing of Water

    On more than one occasion when people were in dire need of water, the blessing of the Muhammad saved them. In the sixth year after the he migrated from Mecca to Medina, Muhammad went to Mecca for pilgrimage. In the long journey through the desert, people ran out of all water, only the Prophet was left with a vessel with which he performed ablution for prayers. He put his hand in vessel, water began flowing from between his fingers. Jabir bin Abdullah, who witnessed the miracle, says of the fifteen hundred men, ‘We drank it and made ablution.’[3] This miracle has been transmitted with an unbroken chain of reliable scholars (hadith mutawatir).[4]

    The sprouting of water from human fingers is similar to the Moses’ miracle of producing water from a rock.
    Blessing of Food

    On more than one occasion, the Prophet blessed food by either praying or touching it so all present could get their fill. This happened at times when food and water shortage afflicted Muslims.[5] These miracles took place in the presence of a large number of people and is, thus, not possible to deny.
    Healing the Sick

    Abdullah ibn Ateek broke his leg and Muhammad healed it by wiping his hand over it. Abdullah said it was as if nothing had happened to it! The person who witnessed the miracle was another companion, Bara’ ibn Azib (Saheeh Al-Bukhari)

    During the expedition of Khyber, Muhammad healed the painful eyes of Ali ibn Abi Talib in front of a whole army. Ali, many years later, became the fourth caliph of Muslims.[6]
    Exorcising Devils

    Muhammad exorcised the devil out of a boy brought by his mother for healing to him by saying, ‘Come out! I am Muhammad, the Messenger of God!’ The woman said, ‘By the One who sent you with the truth, we have never seen anything wrong with him since.’[7]
    Prayers Answered

    (1) The mother of Abu Hurayra, a close companion of Muhammad, used to speak ill of Islam and its prophet. One day, Abu Hurayra came weeping to Muhammad and asked him to pray for his mother to be saved. Muhammad prayed and when Abu Hurayra returned home he found his mother ready to accept Islam. She bore the testimony of faith in front of her son and entered Islam.[8]

    (2) Jarir ibn Abdullah was commissioned by the Prophet to rid the land of an idol worshipped besides God, but he complained he was could not ride a horse well! The Prophet prayed for him, ‘O God, make him a strong horseman and make him one is guides and is guided.’ Jarir testifies he never fell off his horse after the Prophet prayed for him.[9]

    (3) The people were struck with famine during the time of Muhammad. A man stood up when Muhammad was delivering the weekly sermon on Friday, and said, ‘O Messenger of God, our wealth has been destroyed and our children are starving. Pray to God for us.’ Muhammad raised his hands in prayer.

    Those in attendance testify that that the moment he lowered his hands after praying, clouds began to build like mountains!

    By the time he stepped down of his pulpit, rain was dripping from his beard!

    It rained the whole week till next Friday!

    The same man stood up again, complained this time, ‘O Messenger of God, our buildings are destroyed, and our property is drowned, pray to God for us!’

    Muhammad raised his hands and prayed, ‘O God, (let it rain) around us, but not on us.’

    Those in attendance testify that the clouds withdrew in the direction he pointed, the city of Medina was surrounded by clouds, but there were no clouds over it![10]

    (4) Here is the beautiful story of Jabir. He testifies that on one time, the camel he was riding was exhausted because it was used for carrying water. The camel could hardly walk. Muhammad asked him, ‘What’s the matter with your camel?’ On finding out how tired the poor camel was, Muhammad prayed for the poor animal and from that time, Jabir tells us, the camel was always ahead of others! Muhammad asked Jabir, ‘How do you find your camel?’ Jabir responded, ‘It is well, your blessing has reached it!’ Muhammad bought the camel from Jabir on the spot for a piece of gold, with the condition that Jabir ride it back to the city! On reaching Medina, Jabir says he brought the camel to Muhammad the next morning. Muhammad gave him the piece of gold and told him to keep his camel![11]

    It is no wonder why those around him who witnessed these great miracles performed in front of crowds were certain of his truthfulness.
    These are many..I can still post more.
     
    muslim, Sep 11, 2006 IP
  12. Arnie

    Arnie Well-Known Member

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    #192
    muslim
    check the website in the signature and see how it all is debunked.:p
     
    Arnie, Sep 12, 2006 IP
  13. muslim

    muslim Peon

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    #193
    Brother
    I dont read and see false websites written by group of lairs and fools with no logic, understanding and reasoning but only hatred towards other religions.

    I challenge you if you can yourself prove my posts wrong on your own research from Bible and Quran rather than quoting from false websites.

    The fastest growing religion in the world today is Islam and most christians and jews from US and Europe are converting to Islam because it is a true religion. We are not converting them on gun point and sword.They are very intelligent and knowledgeable to find the truth themselves.
    You guys are dumb and deaf to criticize our religion and our prophet again and again even when I posted everything what you are criticizing. You can never prove me wrong but I answered all your queries.
     
    muslim, Sep 12, 2006 IP
  14. Red Fairy

    Red Fairy Peon

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    #194
    why do you guys take everything so serious and literal,
    it is not the words you need to know
    but the meaning behind them
     
    Red Fairy, Sep 12, 2006 IP
  15. angellica2017

    angellica2017 Peon

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    #195
    Hey, what happened to you? Already reading your books again? Then what you would say at my post?

    "We are not converting them on gun point and sword"

    LOL... then what happens to your prophet's enemy? LOL
    Three optional at your books for the enemy (have you read it yet?) :
    a. Receive Allah and his prophet --> Life with pressure
    b. Paying taxes --> Life with pressure
    c. Refuse Allah and his prophet --> die by sword

    How?
     
    angellica2017, Sep 12, 2006 IP
  16. debunked

    debunked Prominent Member

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    #196
    This guy is too funny. He goes to a website and copy/pastes the false information as if it was research and the gets all angry because no one believes him.... LOL

    Christians are converting.... I am sure a few but if they know the truth then they won't, so whats the point?? If you convince someone that those things you copy and paste are true, with the descriptions some muslim leader created than they didn't know the truth in order to see the false.

    Truth hurts huh muslim? If you desire to follow a false prophet like mohammad, Raz, or Joseph smith, it is your choice, well maybe, except you will have your head cut off if you choose not to follow mohammad (a dead guy)
     
    debunked, Sep 12, 2006 IP
  17. KalvinB

    KalvinB Peon

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    #197
    A Mormon leader once said "all the thinking has been done." What they were talking about is all the "difficult doctrines." He was saying don't worry if you don't understand something, we understand it so just trust us.

    Meanwhile in non-cult religions, leaders will agree with you when you point out a difficult doctrine is difficult. My pastor will do his best but say "I don't know" on certain things. And they train their members to think for themselves. To critically analyize the Bible on their own so when people ask they can give an answer.

    It's standard procedure in cults to provide vast amounts of information to counter claims. The goal is not to convert others but to convert those who read it. People who already accept that their cult is the true religion but are maybe doubting a bit see the information and assume that a smart person put it together so it must be true and they don't have to think about it themselves.

    When said information gets presented to a nonbeliever who can see through the garbage, the believer is of course not going to accept the nonbeliever's analysis and the result is reinforcment of their preexisting beliefs.

    I mean seriously debunked, who are we to challenge the great and powerful oz? I mean Imam.

    The Quran says the moon was split in two so it must be true. Oh but shucks. Even the Devil himself can do miracles. Jesus didn't do miracles to prove his divinity. That's why he only did them around and for believers.

    I'll take the long list of miracles as an admission that Mr M was not a true prophet.

    If he were a true prophet Muslim would have posted prophecies. But apparently there are none. Case closed. Muhammed, spit be upon him, is a false prophet as Muslim has proven.
     
    KalvinB, Sep 12, 2006 IP
  18. muslim

    muslim Peon

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    #198

    even you are funny.Do you think I am the writer of Bible ha ha. I post what is there in your Bible. IF you say I am wrong then you are contradicting your bible and proving Bible is wrong and full and errors.
    Even I am trying to say that only.Today's Bible which you are following is fake (large portion) and full of errors.

    We know we are following the right path and we are heading towards the right direction.We have deep love and respect of our true and greatest prophet Muhammad(PBUH) who was the last messanger of God and Jesus(PBUH) also who was beloved prophet of God.
     
    muslim, Sep 12, 2006 IP
  19. KalvinB

    KalvinB Peon

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    #199
    Oh I forgot. In cults when all else fails, give your testimony.
     
    KalvinB, Sep 12, 2006 IP
  20. muslim

    muslim Peon

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    #200
    can you please tell what you are trying to say. Give example..
     
    muslim, Sep 12, 2006 IP