An alternative to Obamacare, starting with advice from Whole Foods

If your house has termites, you have several options for a legitimate course of action. I would argue that living with the problem is better than the fixing the problem if by "fixing the problem" you mean setting your house on fire. I would also argue that setting your house on fire may kill the termites, but it is not really a solution to the problem. I think the majority of Americans understand that as well.

Perhaps you aren't aware of this, but paying your chiropractor(witch doctor IMO) directly would cost you much less than your insurance premiums?

 

- Not to be taken seriously but a good place to begin for finding a remedy - worked out in my case. Did pay for it myself however all is reported as open records for all to review and was the response of the insurer when reviewing the record.

In nearly every respect for those who have health insurance the new legislation will be beneficial despite the above meaningless analogy to termites and suggest the Republicans take a breather and work to make it even better - as in a national hub for private enrollment or gov't option for those comfortable with that type plan.

 

The problem is, no problem has been solved. Instead a new one has been created.

 

You shouldn't feel alone on this Breeze. Most liberals aren't able to associate mandatory purchase of a product as "burning the house down". They only see the termites(Problems with health care in the US). I sometimes wonder how many steps towards totalitarianism Liberals would be willing to take if they thought it would suit some goal. If you could go back in time and tell the founding fathers that you wanted the federal govt. to mandate that every man, woman, and child buy some product, they would have laughed you out of town, and you KNOW that is the truth. This is how far you've come. Before long, you WILL be saying, "they only want us all to wear tracking devices.".

This is aside from the blatant fiscal irresponsibility in this legislation that won't even meet it's stated objectives. Spending another couple trillion dollars right now,after 8 years of Bush spending IS BURNING THE HOUSE DOWN. Democrats were elected to office on that very premise.

 

You two are hopeless.....healthcare is a national endeavor that no one is exempt from or have it your way and pay the "fine for liberty" and all will be well.

Apparently you two have not had a hospital event, as no one in their right mind has and not seen Freddie Kruger in action.

 

I broke my wrist about as bad as you can break it. on Saturday. I think I've had quite a bit of experience with both an emergency room and my orthopedist in the past few days.

Funny thing. Every doctor and nurse had some rather unkind words for Obama, Pelosi and the rest of the morons on the left. And yes, I have what one might call a "Cadilac Plan", and I pay for it, out of my own pocket. And I pay income tax on it too.

Nope, sorry, Jer and his business are exempt from the Federal government violating our Constitutional rights. I won't be participating in the plan, and I certainly won't be paying any fines. I believe like Biden, this is a big fucking deal.

 

Sound like you are already "participating in it."

You have insurance. And, because of that you won't paying any fines. No big deal...

BTW, what constitutional rights are being violated? In your case it sounds like very little will change.

 

Sigh, it's sad to see that some adults have no idea what our Constitution says and why it says what it does. Very, very sad.

And Obamanation, very good examples you've given using the "burning down the house" analogy. That's exactly what I feel is going on, except the house is the Constitution and we're burning it so some people can feel warm and fuzzy or "save" a little bit of money.

It's simple really, I don't know why some people can't understand our displeasure with this bill. The Federal Government's job is to protect our rights as outlined in the Constitution. They are not here to get involved in "moral issues" such as free healthcare for everyone, marriage, etc. That's where the States come in. The power is left up to the people in each individual state to decide such matters. That way, we don't allow one entity to get too large (the Federal Government) and preserve freedom of choice. If my state passes a law that I REALLY don't agree with, I have the choice to leave and move to another state more to my liking. Why people want to treat the Federal Government like a big tit to save a couple of bucks on their healthcare is beyond me. I guess we need to start asking ourselves: can a pricetag be put on our freedom?

 

I'm paying my own way, out of my own pocket. I'd hardly call that participating in anything.

It's not that hard to do. You get a job, earn a living and pay for it.

What the feds want me to do with this bill is pay for my employee's health care as they see fit or pay a fine. The fine is less than what I pay for them now, so why should I continue to provide it?

FYI, I myself pay income tax on health care I pay for out of my own pocket. So I guess you could say I am already getting fined.

The violation in the Constitution has to do with states rights the fact that the federal government cannot mandate that individual citizens from individual states buy something against their will.

I've been on both sides here. With and without insurance. I can tell you first hand that the problem is not health care. It's only gonna get worse folks. And thanks to the fucking ingrate ignorant people that voted for these idiots, you're getting what you truly deserve.

 

- Firegirl:

- I have the choice to leave and move to another state more to my liking.

Your interpretation is not what exists but certainly a view some / conservatives embrace - The Bill of Rights is the same for all citizens as they may live comfortably where they please without having to move for reasons conjured because of individual differences.

Health care is a natural event affecting everyone and should be dealt with in a manner appropriate and inclusive in remediation for all the citizenry - no one asks to get sick....Per the previous election by majority consensus and hopefully strengthened when analyzed fairly with the fall midterm elections.

 

No one asks to be unemployed
No one asks to be poor
No one asks to be homeless
No one asks to be hungry

Are there any other "Rights" the state should be granting to all of it's citizens? Lets just get everyone in line with their hand out to receive the govt. guaranteed jobs, homes, food, and wealth because these are the rights of every US citizen.

You notice they used the word ""pursuit" instead of "guarantee". You would grant the poor free healthcare, which is not a right, at the cost of peoples free right to choose whether they want to buy health insurance, which IS a right (Liberty).

Perhaps the govt. should hand out "free" prozac because, after all, everyone has the "Right" to be happy. I must say I am motivated by all this talk. Motivated to quit my job, and line up for my part of the handout.

 

Good point Obamanation. I think most adults I come across don't understand the meaning of "pursuit":

1. The act or an instance of chasing or pursuing.
2. The act of striving: the pursuit of higher education.

That means I have to go after what I want, what I need, what I dream of. That does not guarantee me that I'll automatically get everything that my neighbor has or vice versa. I am responsible for my happiness, well-being, and necessities. The government's job is to protect my freedoms so I can pursue my own path, not carve the path for me.

It sucks that some just seem to be unlucky and get sick, get laid off, etc. But does that mean I should have to give up my RIGHT to choose because some might be unlucky? NO. We can't pay for everyone's hard times or bad luck. I'd much rather protect the freedoms we have, so I can still dream of working for what I want, instead of trading them away so everyone can have a mediocre existence on the government tit.

 

All I ask is that my government do its job and defend my right to pursue happiness. Nothing else.

All I ask of my fellow American is that they ask their congressmen and senators to recite the Preamble from memory. I doubt you'll find many that can.

They will all tell you how they know the 3000 page health care bill inside and out, but cannot recite or few paragraphs, much less remember any of the 4 measly pages that make up our Constitution.

Kinda ironic too that our president who is a Constitutional lawyer seems to have very little if any understanding of the document itself.

 

That would be life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

Interesting you failed to mention the first two.

Does access to health care relate to one's right to life?

Can increased regulation of corporate monoliths increase one's liberty?

I happen to, "take these truths to be self evident." Remember, the documents in question were written when the US was a small, agricultural based economy - long before the rise of our current capitalistic mono-culture in which the vast majority of the citizenry are in servitude to their corporate overlords in so many areas of their lives.

 

Kinda goes without saying. Was it really necessary to mention all three when I was directly quoting a response to the "pursuit of happiness" itself? Not sure what you find so interesting about that.

Try and keep up.

EVERYONE in this country has access to health care. Always have. And frankly, its not a right. Let me clarify. Access to? No, but provided for free? No, not a right.

No more a right than its a right to get a free 650 calorie Big Mac for free just cause you cannot afford it.

Less regulation allows one the ease with which to purse it.

Remember, it was written keeping in mind that what we left behind was not.

 

I agree Mia. Everyone has access to healthcare NOW, it's just not free. Anyone can walk into an ER and get treated. It's against the law to turn anyone away because of an inability to pay in the ER. But nobody brings that up. Now they want it for free too. It's a service, one for which people go to college and spend tons of money to learn, why should we get that for free, or even a severely reduced price? It's called a free market...

 

Around 10 years ago I did not have health insurance. I was admitted with no insurance with a life threatening condition and was not only given urgent emergency care, but probably some of the best money can buy. 2 weeks later the hospitals billing dept called and first asked "how are you feeling". Then they proceeded to set me up on a payment plan that I paid off over time.

Since having insurance, I've been sued by the hospital 3 times.

Go figure.

You pay for what you get. No one should have to be forced to pay for someone else. No one should have to have their right to pursue their own destiny trampled by a government hell bent on controlling them.

There is not now, nor has there ever been a health care problem or crisis. The problem is with insurance and demotards.

All I ask in this life is that my government leaves me the fuck alone and gets the fuck out of my way. When they do that, we all succeed.

 

This sums up my feelings exactly.

People forget: it's the job of State government to govern the people. It's the job of the Federal government to govern the states.

BW, sorry, but you are completely wrong.

Yes, the Bill of Rights is the same for everyone - everyone has the same rights. But what IS the Bill of Rights? It's the primary method the Founding Fathers devised to protect all citizens from the government.

The diversity of the United States is enshrined in the diversity and the sovereignty of our individual States. The Federal government doesn't govern the people, it governs the States. The President isn't elected by the people, the President is elected by the States. Do you see the pattern? We send our elected representatives to Washington to represent our State.

And, if you don't like the laws of your State, you are free to move to another State, like I did.

The people of the United Sates are a rich and diverse people. It's just as irrational to expect one central government to create one set of laws that will satisfy 307 million people, as it is for someone to sit in one place and expect the government to build laws around them to satisfy THEM and ignore others.

THAT is why we have individual states. A Republican form of government is NOT for the lazy. If your neighbor likes the laws of your state but you don't, you have the freedom and the right to move to another State. This is a freedom and a right that you do not enjoy if you live in a Communist or Dictatorship government. And, if you chose to be lazy and not exercise that right, that freedom, then you do not have the right to create discomfort for your happy neighbor because you are too lazy.

 

It just keeps getting better. It turns out the new health care bill is like a naked doll which needs to be dressed up a bit. In that spirit, congress is now passing small pieces of legislation with unknown fiscal impact to get in all the bells and whistles they wanted in the original legislation. As Sen. Bacaus now admits, its about fixing up 'Mal-Distribution of income'.
[video=youtube;TPRPqeYi-60]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPRPqeYi-60[/video]

I wonder what the real cost will be when all the add ons are figured into the cost....

I just saw Gerry Brown, would be governor of California talking about how immediate action needs to be taken by the federal govt. on health care to bring down costs. He said the legislation we have is a good start, but if we don't address costs immediately, health care will be unaffordable. He cited as an example how a night in a hospital in America starts at $3k where as a night in a hospital anywhere else never exceeds $1k. I was trying to figure out if he was trying to imply the health care reform he just supported didn't reform anything at all....