How can a writer Test the Integrity of a Buyer?

Discussion in 'Copywriting' started by omcliem, Jan 30, 2010.

  1. #1
    I have had this question in mind for a very long time now. Over the time I have seen way too many people (buyers) coming up with large projects of their own and invite offers, but they are there with absolute no trading history. Many of them have been scammers.
    Now how can some as a reputed and established writer not fall in their trap. ?
    I mean what should be the way for a writer when dealing with such elements.

    Please, tell in the terms if Negotiation, Work Agreements and Payments.
    And any other suggestions to testify their Integrity as a Buyer.

    Regards
    Om
     
    omcliem, Jan 30, 2010 IP
  2. Perry Rose

    Perry Rose Peon

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    #2
    In most cases, I am afraid that there is really no way.

    You could try looking at their sites for any other writers' articles there.

    If there are, and it is updated, that is a good sign.

    Always ask for 50% upfront anyway. That way you're covered.
     
    Perry Rose, Jan 31, 2010 IP
  3. Otillier011

    Otillier011 Greenhorn

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    #3
    Sadly, we don't have a fail-safe method to determine whether we are dealing with a crook or not. However, there are certain "red flags" that can help us avoid being victimized by these crooks. If the buyer is offering an outrageously high rate and is requesting a test article without any commitment to pay, then chances are the guy is up to something that is not good. Of course, there is the usual feedback and buyer rating which gives you a general idea on the background of the buyer. There are also freelance sites that offer escrow arrangements.
     
    Otillier011, Feb 1, 2010 IP
  4. Montanak9

    Montanak9 Peon

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    #4
    I always use Escrow (on Elance).

    That fixes it for me. And if it's not Escrow, then I'll ask 50% in advance.

    If he doesn't accept, they I am not interested in that buyer.


    Montana
     
    Montanak9, Feb 1, 2010 IP
  5. DDunique

    DDunique Peon

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    #5
    The only method I can suggest is asking for a downpayment upfront. If they're happy to go along with this then you can be pretty certain they're legit. If they argue over it, I'd have my doubts.
     
    DDunique, Feb 1, 2010 IP
  6. jhmattern

    jhmattern Illustrious Member

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    #6
    My new clients pay in full up front, so there's no issue (even most non-new clients pay in full up front). If you don't have enough demand to feel comfortable setting terms like that, the best bet is probably to take on a very small project up front. For example, if they want 10 articles, make the contract for one. Then if the process goes smoothly, take on a contract for the other 9. It's similar to clients choosing to buy one up front as a paid "sample," and then deciding whether or not to buy more afterwards.
     
    jhmattern, Feb 1, 2010 IP
  7. tech_savvy

    tech_savvy Peon

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    #7
    trial and error the only way i suppose. however it maybe borne in mind that even the bjuyer has the same issue of apprehension of wether you would give him/her the material in time
     
    tech_savvy, Feb 14, 2010 IP
  8. lucyaw

    lucyaw Peon

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    #8
    Unfortunately the industry rogues have caused a great deal of mistrust on both sides, so it's difficult to negotiate a way to make you both feel 'safe'. I ask for 50% up front payment from new clients and have so far nobody has complained about that set up. Some have even offered to pay in full for the first few pieces so I feel at ease.

    I try to stay away from clients who will only give me their email address and nothing else. This is not only because they can anonymously slip away without paying, but also because I have no idea what kind of website I'm writing for! Being open with contact details, your own website and different ways for them to get in touch seems to build an element of trust.
     
    lucyaw, Feb 15, 2010 IP
    omcliem likes this.
  9. omcliem

    omcliem Member

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    #9
    Lucy, very well said.
    Your points are well taken and understood.
    Even when a writer has a portfolio online then too clients want to pay after getting the work, quoting they would like to test.
    What to do with these kind of people?
     
    omcliem, Feb 15, 2010 IP
  10. Perry Rose

    Perry Rose Peon

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    #10
    Yeah, that was a good post. Get that full name, along with a phone number. It will not help 100%, but it sure as hell will help a lot in weeding out the Bozos.
     
    Perry Rose, Feb 15, 2010 IP
  11. expertofexperts

    expertofexperts Active Member

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    #11
    There are no such exact ways where you can test it. But, you can certainly ask for advance payout after certain amount of articles you have written. Or if the buyer vanishes after taking articles from you then without waiting for a minute more you should submit those articles somewhere over internet and try to get them indexed ASAP.

    It will complete waste for the buyer.
     
    expertofexperts, Feb 15, 2010 IP
  12. DomoArigato

    DomoArigato Active Member

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    #12
    Questions:

    1. If you are a writer demanding 50% upfront, what equal protection does the buyer have that you will not run away with his money? Do you accept Paypal payments and the buyer can demand a chargeback or something if you run away?

    2. If a buyer runs away with your articles, is it possible to use CopyScape to trace your articles to see where they get published? But evenif you see where the article gets published, I suppose it would be difficult to demand a copyright violation?
     
    DomoArigato, Feb 16, 2010 IP
  13. jhmattern

    jhmattern Illustrious Member

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    #13
    1. The buyer always has more protection, exactly for the reasons you mention. They can file chargebacks. A writer has absolutely NO protection. Once a client takes their time, they can't get it back and bill it out to someone else. A non-paying client literally steals the earning potential of a writer. Writing isn't often a generic end product that we can turn around and sell to someone else for the same price.

    2. You would file a DMCA request with their host. If they were that ignorant and actually used the content without paying for it, I wouldn't hesitate to file in court either for collection or copyright infringement depending on the circumstances. If someone charges very little, they might not be as willing to do that though, and that's probably why content thieves think they'll always get away with it.
     
    jhmattern, Feb 16, 2010 IP
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  14. mittt

    mittt Peon

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    #14
    its a very reality question
    many times i too feel afraid of it
    but till yet i got good buyers
    but solution is always ask for 50% upfront anyway
     
    mittt, Feb 16, 2010 IP
  15. puresilk

    puresilk Peon

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    #15

    Whats a DMCA request? I havent heard that term before. From what you say it is safer to go through a third party service where both sides are protected.
     
    puresilk, Feb 16, 2010 IP
  16. expertofexperts

    expertofexperts Active Member

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    #16
    I agree with the first point of yours. But not for the second one. The seller can go for copyright violation but it will take huge time and effort to get back compensation. Still he can easily find out the link in the signature for which the article is posted. Contact that website webmaster or if you don;t get any response then contact 'fraud dept.' of that website hosting company.

    Still you don;t get any response then its worst of all time and post about that poster everywhere you can. And also about that website.
     
    expertofexperts, Feb 16, 2010 IP
  17. DomoArigato

    DomoArigato Active Member

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    #17
    I'm not exactly sure if freelance writers can actually "copyright" their work and claim for DMCA violation. Unlike freelance photographers who can have the ability to "watermark" their images. But articles?

    And it may be difficult for ISP hosts to serve as the referee and respond to just about anyone who claims about copyright "articles" committed by their hosted customers. After all, how can you tell who is telling the truth? Just because the complainant has a popular website, it doesn't automatically mean the popular writer cannot be doubted to have copied his/her articles from someone who is "unknown".

    We all heard about famous musicians who have been charged with plagiarism by "lesser known" artists. And all this trouble for what? 20 bucks?
     
    DomoArigato, Feb 18, 2010 IP
  18. jhmattern

    jhmattern Illustrious Member

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    #18
    An article is copyright-protected the moment it's created -- it's no different than photographs, and the writer is not required in any way to "mark" it.

    It's not about what you'll get back. It's about the principle of maintaining the integrity of your hard work and not allowing others to profit from it (which is nothing short of theft). Professionals care about such things. Every time their work is stolen, it demeans the value of every word they sell (why would someone else pay for a professional when they can just steal it and assume they'll get away with it?). It's not that difficult for ISPs. I've had work removed fairly quickly by them in the past when people have stolen things like blog posts. It's easy enough to verify when a document was created, when a contract was signed, when emails with project details were exchanged, etc. You send along the evidence you have, and they get a response from the thief or insist on its removal. It's a fairly painless process for the writer.
     
    jhmattern, Feb 18, 2010 IP
  19. omcliem

    omcliem Member

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    #19
    Jennifer, its a blessing to have a person as graceful and as wise like you in the DPF. Your advice is really a helpful one.
    Thanks
     
    omcliem, Feb 20, 2010 IP
  20. inspiroHost

    inspiroHost Peon

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    #20
    Ask them to pay upfront in escrow. I always put the money in escrow first when I am buying through sites like freelancer.com.
     
    inspiroHost, Feb 21, 2010 IP