So it was big news yesterday that Obama Effigy had been found hanging at some place FBI is Investigating Obama Effigy Hanging and two suspects have been detained SO everyone what's wrong with having a effigy ? what is being investigated ? why they detained someone ? isn't there any 'freedom of speech/expression' ? why is everyone silent here at the forums ? why don't you condemn this attack on freedom of expression ? why not put on avatars supporting the effigy ? like you have put on in support of 'freedom of expression' of the cartoon guy ?
The Secret Service, which deals with threats to the President, has confirmed that it is investigating the incident. Obviously they need to know if this guy is a wack job and a real threat. I'd be suprised if he gets charged and he sure won't have a bounty on his head. Lucky for him he lives in the States, No?
This is New's indirect complaint about your avatar, Genuine Marketer. I guess he doesn't understand that that the secret service takes every threat to the President's life, joking or otherwise, seriously. Maybe he feel's your avatar is threatening Mohamads life? To be honest, I'm not sure what type of crack he is smoking now.
this should concern you as much as the danish cartoonist concerned you Obviously is a nice word did you say that the danish cartoonist is a wacko job? may be he was planning to blow Muslims up? or wanted to push others to do the same by spreading hate ? How is an effigy a threat to life ? black magic may be?
With your logic skills, this is going to be hard for you to grasp, but I'll put it to print anyway. Any perceived threat to someones life is taken seriously, especially when that someone is the president. If I were to send you notes with pictures of you with a drawn in knife through the heart, they would be taken seriously. No, I probably wouldn't be arrested on that alone, but if I were to keep sending you such notes, I would probably be charged with harassment and definitely be put under surveillance. I'm not sure simply drawing someone famous, or anyone for that matter, being killed in effigy without specifically making sure said person sees the art is a matter for concern because it is not targeted. When it comes to the president, all such matters, targeted or not, are taken seriously. So I ask you again. How could Mohammad's life be at risk? A better question still, what does the Mohammad art have to do with killing Mohammad? Answer: Nothing. The art implies Islam is a religion of terrorists, and interestingly, the Islamic terrorists are the ones that seem to respond most to it. Obviously you took no offense to the many pieces of art depicting Ariel Sharon as a blood crazed butcher. So what is different between those pieces of art and the one I use as my Avatar? Answer: Nothing.
perceived threat ? may be it was a mockery of the president ? If Effigy is a threat than I can also argue that the cartoons were a threat to 1bn Muslims of the World as their purpose was the incite hate and arouse others to commit hate crimes against Muslims ? Can you for once? for once! leave aside, for a moment, the obvious prejudice that you have for Muslims? and think with an open heart ? may be you will realize the double-standards practiced by west, when it comes to aggravating Muslims they will start chanting "FREEDOM OF SPEECH, FREEdOM OF EXPRESSION" and when it comes to them, they can apprehend you on HANGING a Effigy and no one will raise their voice that FREEDOM has been violated I understand, hanging a effigy is bad, the hate is Crystal clear and so it was from the Cartoons Either you find both of them OK or Both of them BAD
Apparently, they take no issue with these either... pmwAl-Hayat Al-Jadida September 12 2007 pmwAl-Hayat Al-Jadida March 4 2008
It is not me who cries over 'freedom of speech' it is you ? so why don't you raise the voice when you are not allowed to practice it in your own land ? what you say about the effigy ? Why don't you put an avatar of effigy to support freedom of speech ?
When speech becomes the vehicle with which to commit a crime, or to PROMOTE a crime, or indicate the intention to commit a crime, the 1st amendment has no shelter. Never has, never will. That's why what you say can be used against you in court. That's why if you tell your neighbor, "I'm going to burn down your house this Friday", you are not protected by freedom of speech and you can be arrested and questioned - and if your threat is toothless, released. Freedom of speech, and freedom of expression, cannot be used to promote criminal activity. You can't set fire to your neighbor's house and call it "freedom of expression", because setting that fire is a crime. You can't threaten the President and call it "freedom of speech", because threatening the President is a crime. However, the threat must be real. That's why the moron that hung the effigy has been investigated, but he has NOT been arrested. Understand? I was raised to believe that racists are stupid. However, it's not against the law to be stupid. It's also not against the law to threaten the life of someone who's legally dead. Do you understand, new?
Hanging an effigy is a mock murder. It's of a specific living person. They just want to investigate to ensure that someone doesn't intend to make their fantasy a reality.
As I predicted, you were unable to get it. There are all kinds of images of Obama floating around, showing him as Hitler, as a Socialist, as the Joker(from batman), as a friend of deep pockets lobbyists. Almost all of those pictures are based on some perception of the man, correct, or incorrect. None of those artists are being arrested, or even investigated. These images are analogous to your Mohammad art, and even the most zealous Obama supporters are not threatening the artist's lives. Save your hollow argument for the Mosque.
Pot. Kettle. Black. No, mockery is acceptable. Infringing on the freedoms of others is not. Do you understand the difference?
Freedom of speech has two sides, the good and the bad. You have to accept both otherwise it wouldn't be freedom. Some things are highly offensive, but as long as someone's rights are not being infringed upon, we have to accept them to keep freedom of speech truly free....
new: Don't try and bs us that you care about 1bn Muslims. Muslims keep killing Muslims. I keep bringing up examples. Muslims are slaughtering innocent Muslim women and children. You have not expressed one tiny iota of concern about the slaughter of Muslims by Muslims. Time and again the issue has been brought up and time and again you avoid it. Its a good thing I'm here. I care about these innocent Muslims, slaughtered by the fundamentalist terrorists you support. Don't bother us with this gibberish about 1bn Muslims. You have continuously shown you don't care about the Muslims being slaughtered by Muslims. You only care about the terrorist killers. Meanwhile there are Muslims who care about Muslims being slaughtered by Muslims. Read this article that follows up on the terrorist attack of a volleyball Match in Pakistan right after the New Year that killed over 100 local Muslims: http://www.thenews.com.pk/daily_detail.asp?id=216740 An excerpt from the article reveals someone who cares about the 1bn Muslims... new: you only care about the Militants. Ahmad Ali and I care about the innocent children. Since you support the militants Ahmad Ali thinks you don't even deserve to be called a human.
It's already January 5th and I nominate earlpearl's preceding post as Post of the Year! So, new, is it your position that ANY cartoon that has the potential to incite religious hatred should be illegal? Do you believe that the same protection should be extended to the Christian cross? And that the same protection should be extended to the Jewish Star of David? Speaking for myself as a Christian, I believe that hatred is not a part of my religion. There exist artists that place crucifixes in urine, and I believe that my religion shrugs it off. I don't hate the artist, I feel sorry for them. My faith is unaffected. new, do you believe that hatred is part of YOUR religion? I don't believe that all Muslims would agree with you. But I sincerely want to know, new, what YOU believe about how YOU practice YOUR religion and how hatred is part of it. Can you tell us, please?
It would seem that inability to distinguish peaceful protest/reform through non-violent means from bloodshed and violence is not uncommon in the Muslim world: http://article.wn.com/view/2009/12/07/Death_to_the_Dictator_shout_Iranian_protestors/ http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20091227/wl_nm/us_iran Its one of the many reasons I don't put too much stock in a new Iranian government being any better than the current one.
I don't think so. The Iranis are fans of the west - they are hungry for a better life quality, more music, more technology, more internet, more gadgets. If a revolution will occur, there are good chances that the government will be democratic. It will be pro-western for sure. LOL Im laughing everytime I open a thread and I see everybody with the Mohammed danish caricature.