Evolution or intelligent design

Discussion in 'Politics & Religion' started by evolving, Jul 31, 2006.

?

are you pro-evolution or pro- intelligent design

  1. pro evolution

    73.3%
  2. pro intelligent design

    26.7%
  1. #1
    give some arguments if you have
     
    evolving, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  2. tesla

    tesla Notable Member

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    #2
    I believe in both. There is evidence to support evolution, and it is likely that intelligent design is involved as well.
     
    tesla, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  3. chulium

    chulium Well-Known Member

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    #3
    I guess I'm the 20% minority so far: I believe in Intelligent Design.

    God made us in his image, we didn't evolve from monkeys.
     
    chulium, Jul 31, 2006 IP
  4. marketjunction

    marketjunction Well-Known Member

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    #4
    How about Intelligent Evolution or Evolutionary Design?

    Ah, just got my next book idea. BRILLIANT!

    weeeeeee :D
     
    marketjunction, Aug 1, 2006 IP
  5. frankcow

    frankcow Well-Known Member

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    #5
    Even the theory of intelligent design is misleading, it makes God seem inpersonal, a removed, unknowable, but intelligent being/force

    I agree with compuXP
     
    frankcow, Aug 1, 2006 IP
  6. 1EightT

    1EightT Guest

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    #6
    evolution hands down
     
    1EightT, Aug 1, 2006 IP
  7. guy123

    guy123 Guest

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    #7
    Intelligent design. I was somewhat surprised with the majority voting evolution for some reason.
     
    guy123, Aug 1, 2006 IP
  8. dcole07

    dcole07 Peon

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    #8
    we didn't evolve from monkeys, monkeys and humans evolved from the same relative!

    I say evolution... you see Science tells it's story though rocks as God tells his story though Humans... And the last time a rock lied to me was.. never, vs. a human... man, they just like lying! Also rocks don't have this mental thing that makes dreams seam like reality! Rocks don't have imaginary friends that say the government planted chips in them... stuff like that. Then this thing in the sky, comes and takes me away to far places... only to take me back home, some people call them UFO, others tell me they are aliens or airliens, maybe airlines... starts with an A!!

    So who created us? Well if we HAVE to have a creater, then doesn't our creater have to have a creator? Well that's a sin, sends you to hell just for thinking such things... unless you were listening to the rock. Then in which case you will not go to hell but I lost my rock...

    Sry, gotta go find my rock before it sends me to hell... wait, never mind.. rocks are all forgiving! Sin-less!

    So over view:
    Rocks: don't lie, all forgiving, sin-less...
    God: hell, sins, lies...

    if you have hell then you can't be all forgiving... unless you do, but that's then a lie, which is a sin!
     
    dcole07, Aug 1, 2006 IP
  9. Cheap SEO Services

    Cheap SEO Services <------DoFollow Backlinks

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    #9

    Hehehehe....That's pretty funny. However, I believe in a creator and that he has always been and always will be. He can also make rocks do just about anything. Therefore, rocks have no power at all.:)
     
    Cheap SEO Services, Aug 1, 2006 IP
  10. chulium

    chulium Well-Known Member

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    #10
    Somebody wanna tell me how DNA is intelligent enough on its own to make the most dominant species on the planet, capable of making its own choices and having a true SOUL without a diety guiding it? Is it any miracle we've survived this long ... by ourselves?

    If it's a miracle, then a God must exist, because miracles are psychically impossible.
     
    chulium, Aug 1, 2006 IP
  11. darksat

    darksat Guest

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    #11
    Thats a contradiction in terms.
    and who says god didnt create evolution.
    I realise it leaves the creationists who believe in the literal bible out in the dust but there is a big difference between creationisim and ID.
    ID creates evolution, which is IMHO the way it happened, there is no one or the other, both are right.
     
    darksat, Aug 2, 2006 IP
  12. dcole07

    dcole07 Peon

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    #12
    All DNA found in any living thing is less than 1% different from another living thing. So if you've ever writen a essay and messed up the spelling of one letter in one word, if that would have been DNA... you would have changed joe into an Ant.

    Also DNA isn't smart, it's random. DNA has errors and if you die before having kids, then the error dies! But if you live and everyone with the error lives and people without the error die, then the error is no longer an error but an advantage! Which makes the people with thr error better than everyone else.

    Also humans are just a dot on the timeline. We have been around 0.000007% of the total time the earth has been around, that's not even close to the age of the universe. So if you took a billion question test and got one question wrong... BAG.. no humans. If Bill Gates dropped 1 penny would he pick it up?? because if he doesn't then there would be no humans. If NASA was God, it would have lost us in a space shuttle explotion even if we were around 3000 times longer! (nasa loses the space shuttle 0.02% of the time!)

    so to speak... you know just to put it in perspective!
     
    dcole07, Aug 2, 2006 IP
  13. chulium

    chulium Well-Known Member

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    #13
    If it isn't smart and it's actually random, then how does it evolve to better adapt to its environment?
     
    chulium, Aug 2, 2006 IP
  14. evolving

    evolving Peon

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    #14
    i agree on all what dcole said except that i disagree that DNA of all creatures is 99% similar , actually DNA similarity is very variable , you have 40% to 99,9% similarities for different creatures.

    to understand the evolution , you should understand that nature is the hardest and most savage element.
    the weak are condemed to die , any changement in the DNA that is bad for the evolution of the species can lead to the death of the individual that had this changement , it like the deseases that we have these days and that are related to gene problems.
    on the other hand some deseases may be an advantage for the individual in certain conditions , and thus he will be more adapted than other that do not have this desease ,
    more adapted means more confort , more time to give kids, that in their turn are more adapted and more fit and thus they give more kids and so on...
    eventually this single individual will have more desendant than the entire group of animals that he was with ,
    in this situation , either the others simply lose on the long term
    or if this individual is in an isolated place with no much contact with the masses of his species , he'll and his progeny will form a new species
    just like donkeys and horses,...
     
    evolving, Aug 2, 2006 IP
  15. Skinny

    Skinny Peon

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    #15
    I believe that God created us just like the Bible stated. There is plenty of evidence to prove so.

    I'm not going to open them up here cause I have to go out but there is.

    Evolution doesn't make sense. The human brain is what scientists have called one of the most complex things they have ever studied and to say it came by chance defies logic?

    Here's a simple idea:

    House are built by people. If you took bricks, cement, windows, doors, nails, etc and shook them up what are the chances you'd build a house? Very very very slim.

    or

    What are the chances that you put 10 pieces of paper labelled 1 -10 with and then pulled them out 1 through 10 in the proper order.

    The chance of that happening is acutally 1 in 3628800. That's (0.00000026%).

    We're only dealing with 10 variables. Now when we talk about space, physics, chemistry, biology and all the millions of complexities that involve each one the chances of that happening are so slim that they are "highly improbable".

    Skinny
     
    Skinny, Aug 2, 2006 IP
  16. Person

    Person Guest

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    #16
    Of course, this is aboslutely NOT analogous to evolution. Evolution is not random, it is deterministic.

    Let's talk about your paper analogy. Our chances of pulling a 1 are 1/10. Pull out a number until you get a 1 and record the number of tries it took (if you want to), then leave the 1 out. Pull another number. If it was a 2, keep it out with the 1. If it wasn't, put the second number back in but leave the 1 OUT. Now, keep drawing until you pull up a 2. See where the problem is? Any organism with a first number other than 1 dies, so the chains that go 947... etc. have a probablity of ZERO. What you did to find your probablity was multiply the odds of each event happening. This is not how evolution works. Chances are it took about 10 tries to pull out 1 and about 9 to pull out 2. It should likewise take 8 to pull out 3, 7 to pull out 4, 6 to pull out 5, 5 to pull out 6, 4 to pull out 7, 3 to pull out 8, 2 to pull out 9, and couldn't have taken more than 1 to pull out 10 (it is the only number left). Add them up and it should take about 55 tries to pull out all the papers in order, by no means an impossible sum. Even if we keep the probability of pulling the correct number even at 1/10, it shouldn't take much more than 100 tries. The issue of improbability isn't really an issue.
     
    Person, Aug 2, 2006 IP
  17. lorien1973

    lorien1973 Notable Member

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    #17
    In short form; probabability doesnt matter because it doesn't have to happen every time, it just has to happen once ;)
     
    lorien1973, Aug 2, 2006 IP
  18. dcole07

    dcole07 Peon

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    #18
    I though I explained it but in simple terms, if this new DNA is better you live and everyone else dies, but if it's not then you die and everyone else lives. This is the black/white verson... it's not really that simple, it's complex.

    Also when looking at evolution, you have to look at the big pic. If I asked you to make a new passenger jet that holds 7000 people and you lived back in the 1700 and couldn't get help from anyone knowing anything about anything to do with any part of airplanes. Then it would be very hard for you to do it! I'm also only going to give you 9 months to do this and I want 3 by the way.

    Or I could start from the biginning! If I now asked you to though an object... any object, but you only have 3 billions years to do it. You see it took something like 3 billion (don't quote me) to make 2 cells work together, but now we have a complex brain made up of billions of cells working together!

    So if we where to graph # of cell working together to time..

    Now, I have seen THE TIMELINE, and no where on it is GOD! Although my science teacher was born twice and died three time according to the timeline.
    umm... but that's only because it became a "wiki-timeline" until the teacher took a look at it...
     
    dcole07, Aug 2, 2006 IP
  19. Person

    Person Guest

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    #19
    No, in short form, the analogy to pulling numbers in sequential order is false because evolution doesn't take place in some gigantic "superstep."
     
    Person, Aug 3, 2006 IP
  20. lorien1973

    lorien1973 Notable Member

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    #20
    Yes, I know. I can make arguments for and against evolution. I am not saying the numerology thing makes sense (cuz it doesn't), I was just shortening the book for people whose eyes were glazing over :p My answer was the short form of the original explanation :p
     
    lorien1973, Aug 3, 2006 IP