Fair enough Yo-Yo if you wish to decline a civil discussion on biblical points then thats ok with me, it's certainly not my intention on this forum to argue with anyone, rather i'm here to add my thoughts to threads & clarify points on scripture should anyone ask.
The first post with the story is flawed... We have no proof that god exists, that is true but we do have proof that the professors brain exists! I will explain by using the professor's brain and the sun as 2 objects of source. The sun gives of energy as the professor's brain does the same. Other parts of the body read this energy as commands and then do a task, like talking! So if he talkes, then he must have musles that got a message from a source like the brain. Without the brain, there wouldn't be a message and there wouldn't be talking from him. Then the sun, it gives of energy, one energy is light. The light travels to earth and reflects off objects so we can see these objects. Without the sun, there would be no energy, and ther energy that isn't wouldn't be reflecting. Now, I don't have faith that there is a sun, I know there is one! Because I can see a tree when there is a sun in the sky, I know that the sun must exist because when it's gone, I can't see the tree. This is also why atoms exist, because people can see shadows of simple objects that are very small. Yes, I can see the tree with other scources of light energy but they have nothing to do with the sun not existing. So the professor talkes, so he must have a brain. Yes, I could make him talk without a brain, but I have a brain. So if I watched someone without a brain make him talk without his brain, it wouldn't happen. So magicly talking doesn't happen without a brain. I think god is just a short cut to how to explain how everything got started. Everything found so far is made up of atom, atoms are energy and come in many forms, such as solid objects, light, heat... so I would say everthing is made up of energy, without exception. Yet god, who is made of atoms, created atoms. So before atoms, there was nothing, then just magicly there were atoms. ---- --- So if god created us, who created him, and who created the creator of god, and who created the person who created the creator of god, and who created the creator of the person who created the creator of the creator of god? ... See it never ends, there is not begining to this... What I have been told is that it is a sin to ask who created god, or they say god had no creator... he was just always there. So why can't we just remove god and say we(atoms) were always there?? ---- --- There are people on this planet that lie... they don't even know it, they just do it. Some people have even been tested. They too a walk and say shiny objects on the ground, a gun, a army coat... then a month later they were asked what they saw and they believed they saw UFOs and were obduced by aliens and taken a way for a while. Yet none of this happened. So how can a reasonal person like myself be made to believe they were told the word of god? I don't know about other people but I remember with a much detail as I dream. So when I try to remember an even sometimes I can't tell if it was real or a dream. I walked in a corn field, then had a dream about corn. You talked about god to me and I had a dream about him. That doesn't mean god is real or talked to me, doesn't mean corn talked to me or proof that corn exists because I saw it in a dream (not taking in the fact that I smelled, touched, tasted it...)
People: Moses save us! They're coming. Moses: *searches his robes* Damnit... where did I put those 2 powerful electric coils and their power sources... Now I'm making a joke of it. And yea I know it was supposedly God who parted the seas because Moses needed his help. I was just pointing out the complete irrelevancy of your post and just how much it proves...
Allow me to finish that sentence for you. .... through evolution. See how that works?? Evolution is fine to explain how Noah only took a few sets of animals that evolved into what they are today. But the entire world evolving into what it is today? No way...
Yep, because plate tectonics aren't going to raise Mt. Everest very much in a few thousand years. Do you have any particular reason for YOUR asssumption that Mt. Everest used to be lower, or are you assuming it in order to justify the flood? Which are completely fictitious. Any decent amount of water trapped within the earth would either not have enough pressure to release more than a few drops or would be so pressurized that it would be shot out as steam and boil poor Noah and all the fish alive. Is this the inadequate supply on the earth, the mythical vapor canopy, or something else? You don't have enough water. Not even close to enough. This would only happen with ridiculously high pressure. Noah and the fishies get boiled. Also of note is that you don't even attempt to provide a model for how the mountains would suddenly be shifted up, nor even an estimate for how tall Mt. Everest would have been pre-flood. In other words, you're arguing against us from numbers that aren't there. The vapor canopy theory is completely bogus. If the vapor canopy suddenly fell as rain, Noah would have died. Also, we should still see the resulting water today. Too bad the flood never happened and scientists are using isochronic dating now. Would anyone care to provide a shred of evidence that a worldwide flood ever occurred?
Religion has long since forgotten what science has yet to understand. I think the biblical texts are bullshit. I think creationisim is for retards but I believe in spirituality. I know there is something greater than myself. I also know its not the bullshit written in the bible.
Or... you lost the debate and this is the easy way out. Your data and evidence are nonexistent and your "beliefs" are ridiculous. Religion is harmful to yourself, those around you and when its aggregate effect is viewed across the globe and time, it hurts EVERYTHING. Economic and social policies derived from a book written by loonies who also thought the world was flat and the universe revolved around it, are insane. For this world to be able to exist in peace in the future, we must leave our ancient, tribal beliefs behind and move forward to a scientific view of ethics, economics, politics and society.
In other words, you have completely lost all hope of providing evidence for God's existence, so you are going to use a cutsey catch-phrase. Pretty lame.
Joel, The reason I said we just have to agree to disagree is because I gave Yo-Yo scientific evidence re the Moses effect but this was not acknowledged by YoYo, as such then I requested he give me further examples but HE declined to do so, so let me get this straight:- Scientific evidence is asked for - I provide it. I ask for another example for him to give me - HE declines. Of course! crazy me, I am therefore the one that was looking for an easy way out & lost the debate. See how silly your statement was Joel ? Joel, the reason I did not want to carry on was simple, I am not in this thread to 'win' I am here to have a civil discussion, but this was not wanted, as such rather than continue with 'tit for tat' answers the mature thing would be to walk away without anyone being offended or making rude remarks which as seen by your post has already begun. I am more than happy to have a discussion but some here including yourself, quickly resort to name calling & other uncalled for remarks, I try not to do this myself but if I stay in this thread much longer there is a possibility I may, & I dont want that. so again Joel, with respect is it not better that we agree to disagree on this subject ?
Just one last thought, as earlier some asked the question "who created God then "? “The lay view persists—of scientists having ‘disproved’ religion. It is a view that commonly expects scientists to be no believers; that Darwin put the last nails in God’s coffin; and that a succession of scientific and technological innovations since have ruled out the possibility of any resurrection. It is a view that is wildly wrong.†(New Scientist magazine ) If God exists who created him ? many ask this because they can not comprehend the idea of a God as always having existed & always continuing to exist. But is that a sound reason to reject that thought ? For example think about “Timeâ€, no one, even scientists can say for sure when time actually begun ( saying it started with the BB is not an answer because what was before the BB ? scientists can not say time did not exist before that event ) And when does Time end ? our own lives end but time continues, we don’t fully understand the concept of time yet we do not reject the idea of time as always being & always continuing. And what about space ? Astronomers find no beginning or end to space, the farther they look into the universe the more they find, yet again they / we do not reject what the evidence shows, many scientists talk about space as being infinite. The same principle applies to the existence of God, difficult to understand but not impossible. Australian physicist Dr Davies once made this comment “There is no doubt that many scientists are . . . scornful of the notion that there might exist a God, or even an impersonal creative principle.†He added: “Personally I do not share their scorn. . . . I cannot believe that our existence in this universe is a mere quirk of fate, . . . an incidental blip in the great cosmic drama.†But how do we know a God ( a higher life form ) exists ? Has any scientist ever been able to make / produce any living thing from nothing ? No, because all living things ( and non living things ) come from pre-existing materials / living things. What science can say concerning all matter ( alive or not ) is that matter is a form of energy, hence Alberts E = Mc2 The bible & science agree on this point, for concerning the creation of the universe Isa 40: 26 says this “ Raise your eyes high up and see ( the stars, galaxies etc ) Who has created these things? It is the One who is bringing forth the army of them even by number. . . . Due to the abundance of dynamic energy, he also being vigorous in power, not one of them is missing.†Yes all creation started due to tremendous energy, hence the term “the Big Bangâ€. And throughout all creation what do we see ? A very high form of mathematics, a high degree of order & organizing ability, wisdom, even love & artistic ability, all these thing are observed in various ways within the universe & here on Earth, these ‘things’ are not really things but attributes, qualities, things do not have these attributes & qualities but a person does & when God created all things he displayed his attributes as well, as looking at creation testifies. As such I see evidence of a God a creator as having started life, I don’t see the Big Bang as happening from nothing ( and even if it did where did the ingredients of the BB came from ? ) I don’t see the amazing complexities in life as coming from a chance situation, I don’t see the fine tuning in the universe where it works with clock work precision being the result of an uncontrolled explosion, rather I see it as evidence of Gods work.
Czech I agree with you that god exists, I have had enough experience with strange things to prove it to me, however I believe in science. I am saying however that religion is not all its cracked up to be. The people who wrote the bible had never met Jesus. Most religious nutjobs dont have a clue of what god really is and they just made most of that shit up to try to explain something they sensed was there but were unable to comprehend. I am with Einstein God Exists Religion sucks Think I.D not creationisim.
Religion yes, I agree ( but remember God & religion are two different things ) Most never met Jesus true, but some did Agreed. religion is indeed the cause of many of the problems we have today, by all means kill the messenger but not the message ( the Bible ) I do beleive in I.D as my previous post pointed out & I am not a Creationist whom beleive the earth was created in 6 literal days.
No, actually, no one who wrote the bible ever met Jesus. and the council of nicea rewrote the whole thing anyway. Jesus spoke aramaic Bible was written in Greek. The most original english copy, the king james bible was written in 1611 and was one of shakespears greatest works. You want to find god. I can tell you how. If you are ready.
Matthew an apostle of Jesus Christ and the writer of the Gospel bearing his name. Mark ditto James the half brother of Jesus Christ obviously met Jesus. Jude was the brother of James and as such a half brother of Jesus Christ. Luke & Paul while both bible writes did not meet Jesus. My answer to this would be very long & to a degree complicated. The King James bible also has the most errors of any bible I have come across.