Are these pictures real? (Warning - Graphic)

Who's even to say if all of those pictures are of Jews. Did you know there have been NUMEROUS genocides throughout history? How would you handle large amounts of dead bodies, before they start rotting and potentially contaminate the air, water, soil, etc?

Here's just one example:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians_in_the_Soviet_Union

 

Sorry, but I would really prefer that you not bring Zionists, the state of Israel, or Palestine into this. This thread is not about any of that crap , which seems to get way more wear and tear than its worth on this forum. It's not even about Ahmadinijad, though I did mention him as a famous holocaust denier.

Would it matter if only 3 million were killed? How about 1 million? 50,000? How many dead Jews would be an acceptable number in your book?

Look, this thread is very simply about addressing the evidence of the Holocaust. The deniers on this forum have provided a variety of explanation for these photos, including starvation due to the US bombing of railways, disease(typhus), or perhaps exhaustion from overwork. Someone also mentioned they didn't see over a million bodies in the photos. The one question I haven't seen answered yet is, since the overwhelming body of evidence, including personal stories, stories in the history books, these photos, and thousands of other such photos all state that the Holocaust happened, what makes your explanation of these photos right and all of the other legitimate and verified evidence false? Please provide evidence in the form of links that scientifically proves the information currently in our history books is false.

It is interesting to see that 35% of the people polled thus far find these pictures to be either fake, or not evidence of the Holocaust. Many teachers in the UK have decided not to teach about the Holocaust for fear of offending certain ethnic segments of their student body.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/education/article1600686.ece

 

Yes, even though it shouldn't, it does matter. But only because people are using the numbers to further their political agendas. So weather or not we like it, it really does matter.

 

Ok, lets assume it matters. You didn't answer my qiuestion. If it wasn't 6 million, how many would be an acceptable number? Again I don't want to talk about the state of Israel, but assuming your "further political agendas" comment is accurate, what number would be low enough that it would not effectively further anyone's political agenda? Just give me a number. What number does Ahmadinijad suggest?

 

Jews aren't the only ones that suffered losses in WWII.
How many innocent civilians perished, and what is an acceptable number?
What makes the loss of Jewish life more important than others?

 

Very true. Nothing makes a Jews' life more important than someone else's. In the case of the Holocaust, Jews made up the majority of the non-combatants that were rounded up and put into concentration camps. They were not collateral damage from the bombing of a city, they were not armed combatants in the fight. I'm assuming you believe at least that much of the Holocaust account, even if you deny the number was 6 million. So starting with that as a basis, can you answer the question?

 

civilians aren't collateral damage when someone bombs a city, they are the very target.

I voted by mistake for the third option, I think the photos are evidence mass murder did happen.

 

No number is acceptable you idiot. But when someone fakes a number to gain an advantage, it becomes an issue.

 

There is no proof that these pics are from the holocaust, nor that 11 million people were killed (Which AFAIK is the current estimate). That said, there is overwhelming evidence that the holocaust occurred, with 11 million dead, murdered by the Nazis. I would and do believe that these pictures are some evidence in support of that. You Holocaust deniers are conspiracy theorists of the worst order.

 

omg that is sick, I think they are real. But don't post something like this again I didn't know id be clicking on a thread full of dead bodies.

 

If no number is acceptable, how would someone gain an advantage by faking a number?

 

Those images of people are real and the public should realize this if not they are in a another world. Yes there was a hitler and yes there were milions of inocent people killed just because they was jewish and those jewish people was sought out and found to be killed by gas and starvation. This should never and i mean never happen again.

 

Because the numbers matter, just because no number is acceptable doesn't mean that people will sympathize more if 6 million died rather than *10, 50 or 100 thousand" or something. And "never forget" - they wouldn't do that if 10 thousand or so died because if they did we would also be holding "never forget the massacre" days every single day of the year for all kinds of different events.

UNDERSTAND?

 

so we have a starting point of an answer. 10,000 provides no advantage. Would 1 million provide an advantage? How about 250,000? Now the more important question. How many Jews do you think were really killed in the Holocaust?

 

For me,
1) The pictures are evidence.
2) The countless documents with names, origin, etc' written by the highly-ordered extremely well organized Nazis, some of which now reside in the "Israeli holocaust research and memorial institute", called Yad Vashem (see goals and objectives), are also evidence.
3) Reading many books about the holocaust, which made me a small expert (you can ask me very specific questions, I know a lot), is another sort of evidence.

But for me the greatest evidence of all:
Was to see my grandmother in her last days with tears for the first time, telling me about this event where her parents, and all of the 3 sisters were murdered (read about the amazing story of Dina Pronicheva, "survivers" section, and reference 14). My grandmother was lucky to leave a few months earlier and travel east to meet my grandfather, who was an officer in the red army.

The Germans were champions of paperwork and biocracy. Although they tried to destroy as many evidence as they could (i.e. this death camp with 800,000 victims), they just couldn't get rid of all the tons of papers with names, evacuation dates, train shipments to death/forced labour camp, etc. It is funny, that people that believe in a "god", "prophets", miracles and wonders etc', based on one piece of evidence, a book that doesn't say anything, can doubt the holocaust, on which the amount of evidence gathered by researchers is overwhelming. I feel ashamed that I even have to write this post. Here, for example Einsatzgruppen (read the 3rd paragraph).

I have no hard feelings to all of those that question the holocaust. In the west, it seems that they have more important things to teach in history classes. Not my business. Its a pitty, because I find the holocaust to be so interesting, I can't even describe it. Much more than the wifes of this and that king, or this and that battle that he made on his yellow haired horse.... I once even met a guy from india who heared about this event for the first time.


For those who want to get convinced of the holocaust but don't have the time to spend on reading: Take a plane to Krakow, poland, and then a 25 minute bus to "Auschwitz-Birkenau". There, take a local guide (Polish, american, whatever), and see and learn for yourself what happened there.

 

Not sure how any rational person can deny the Holocaust, nor not agree that it was a horrible thing.

That said, doesn't mean one cannot disagree with the policies of Israel, while still having great sympathy and disgust for the Holocaust.

 

I don't know, there never was a proper full scale investigation. Didn't the red cross say about 270,000? Don't know if that was fake or not though, probally was much higher.

 

that is the point. and not only to the jewish people but to nobody. we should not sit silently while some try to dehuminize others and kill them because they can. because they think they are inferior or their religion is inferior.not even if we do not like them and even if it is one of us that is doing the victimizing. that is what we wanted the germans to do and that is what we must all do now. let us not forget what happened

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust#Jews

More links for those who might want to read and learn something before posting shameful posts:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wannsee_Conference
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sobibor
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auschwitz#Death_toll
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treblinka
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einsatzgruppen
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_ghetto
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majdanek

 

Don't reference wikipedia. Some say 500,000 died, some say 12 million.