United States Heading towards a Depression?

Mia:

That is nice that you Could hire 3 more people with lower expenses (taxes and lower mortgage).

We hired one new person for one business we have that is countercyclical and doing well in this bad economy.

I won't hire any new people regardless of taxes if they can't help us make more money, try and make more money with a speculative investment (every investment is speculative imho) or I absolutely need to in order to fulfill certain business needs. If I'm profitable I care as much about taxes as I do about all other costs. They are all the same. If some local government hits with some new crappy @ssed scheme for some fee for some stupid thing...it hits me as much as utility bills going up or the cost of supplies, or the phone company running through new charges...or any other cost.

If the feds raise our taxes on profits....I only care about that stuff to the extent I'm profitable. When not profitable...who gives a rats @ss. If I have to pay stuff like unemployment insurance....it goes to social security. I don't mind. Right now in this environment social security is a better payoff than private retirement funds.

There is a HUGE difference between " I wouldand I could" hire more people with lower taxes. No businesse with lower taxes but NO sales or dramatically lower sales is hiring. None. Why hire people if you are struggling to stay afloat.

Firing some people and cutting back business is how they manage to stay in business.

I'm so glad I don't have a business that is dependant on vehicles. Last year would have screwed my costs. I know lots of business owners. Every one I know who had delivery services as a component of their business was screwed by rising fuel costs. Every single one. It effectively lowered their taxes. I suspect most of them had lower profits...if any profits.

As far as politics goes....and I quote from your comments above....

Take a look at this graph showing US government spending and (receipts/taxes) . Its a long historical review.

All administrations spend more. Dems and GOP. Not one has cut expenses. Lots of talk....no action. Spending always goes up. Over the entire Reagon adminisitration....spending way up. During Bush 1's term....spending way up. During Clinton's term....spending up. Spending went way up during Bush 2's term. The majority of spending in the last administration was built in with GOP running the administration and dominating Congress.

It is pure BS to claim that one party cuts expenses. Its not even close. There is some new cr@ppy @ss federal spending program about educating people to stay in marriage. It just came out. You know who came up with it? The Bush 2 administration. Its just as stupid as one of the stupid things Pelosi was defending in the stimulus bill about birth control...that was ultimately stripped. The Bush 2 administration spent more money on building a "palace"/embassy in Iraq than ever before. Its monstrous. Its palatial. They are still spending money on it. The Bush 2 administration banned review of costs. On the huge monstrously expensive drug program promoted by the Bush 2 administration and passed by the GOP dominated Congress...the administration threatened they would fire the one guy in government who was going to tell the truth about costs before it went up for a vote. Immediately///Immediately after Congress approved it...they came out with true costs that were rediculously higher than estimated.

What an incredible lie to taxpayers.

I've seen stupid Dem spending. Incredibly wasteful. Frankly both sides do the same thing. The only difference is that they have different priorities.

Neither set of priorities works economically "all the time". Bush 2 cut taxes dramatically on individuals. The real significant benefit went to high income earners. I benefitted.

It ended up having no real or long term economic benefit. Now we have this suck economy. Too frigging much money went into consumer debt on mortgages and other the financial institutions went debt crazy and now they are sucking wind....excepting the smaller conservative institutions.

More money went into high earners pockets...but that money didn't find its way into long term productivity. It obviously didn't. It went where the short terms returns were greatest....the real estate and finance worlds...where fees created enormous short term profits. Hey I worked in real estate and closely with finance for over 20 years. I've seen it very first hand. Its mostly mirage economics.

Frankly I would like to see restructuring and lowering of business taxes. Its way too complicated allowing for enormous opportunities for big businesses to get bennies that cut taxes their taxes. They should study it.....eliminate all the special tax breaks then lower the business tax rates. Lower business taxes had a great impact on Ireland. It was a great opportunity for the world to watch. Unfortunately...Ireland is now in the dumps along with the rest of Europe. Who knows if it has a lasting impact.

Unfortunately the GOP doesn't really run on that platform. It doesn't sell politically as well as arguing for lowering individual tax rates. From a political perspective who cares about the real impact....only push what sounds good politically. Pffft. The GOP just don't push business tax cuts in a real serious way. Obviously the Dems don't push it. All I can say is that it did wonders in Ireland. Totally changed that country.

I'm a business guy. I work in partnerships. When we are making money we hire people and expand. If we want to invest in something we hire people. If we are doing well we hire people. To me taxes are like every other expense. Actually income taxes come after everything else. If I'm not making proits...who gives a sh!t about income taxes. Unemployment contributions are an add-on to employee salaries along with any other benefits. By far the worst increase in employee cost add-ons is health insurance. That has been horrible. Its a profit cutting b@ll buster. This decade has been horrendous. We are paying rediculously more and the employee direct contributions are rediculously higher.

I want to see that changed. I want to see cost increases capped somehow or costs lowered and I want to see rules about coverage handled more fairly and less subject to capricious changes by insurers. Do that and my business can do better and my employees do better. I don't care what you call the changes; nationalized health....more private competition....more efficiency....just do it.

Mia: I'm sure you work hard for your income. I do also. We see things differently. The one thing I know for sure is that the GOP pols spend every bit as much money as the Dems pols do. None of them cut costs.

 

Hahahahaaa I love this guy!

 

The economic situation is going to get worse. The forclosures in the New York metro are going to be costly. A lot of multi-famliy dwellings that are non-forming loans over the Freddie/Fannie limit of 417k. I've down some research on some foreclosures and the loans are from unknown banks in places like Philadelphia and South Carolina. I'm wondering what the fallout from this will be. Add to this growing unemployment and a commercial real estate crash and it doesn't look good.

Unemployment is running at 625k new claims per week with 5 million people collecting unemployment benefits and another 1.5 million receiving extended benefits. 12 months from now, unemployment is going to be 10% and then it's all back to housing. How many more foreclosures are we going to see, because people can't afford to pay?

Chicago tea party

Cutting spending is impossible. We need a balanced budget amendment and a flat tax. Everyone needs to be a stakeholder. The way the US is spending now, the tax rate needs to be 50% flat tax. That's where people start to wake up and demand that government stop spending.

Congress passed and Obama signed into law a record $787 billion mix of tax cuts, job-creating projects and aid to struggling states.


Obama plans eclipsing New Deal spending

• The president pledged up to $275 billion in federal aid to help stem a tidal wave of home foreclosures.

• The Treasury Department and the Federal Reserve announced financial-rescue steps that could send up to $2 trillion coursing through the economy.

The spending will raise the federal portion of the U.S. economy to some 31 percent, more than twice the level after eight years of FDR's historic New Deal spending.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090220/ap_on_an/obama_s_big_deal_analysis

 

uh..um....hey dudes...when banks from Philly and South Carolina are making loans in NY....and or any distant bank making loans in distant areas.......THAT is the OPPOSITE of CRA.

 

Subprime is a mess. It looks like we may have another S&L crisis.

The CRA rules were changed in 2005 that allowed Banks to meet their CRA obligations outside of their communities.

In early 2005, the Office of Thrift Supervision (OTS) implemented new rules that – among other changes – allowed thrifts with over $1 billion in assets to meet their CRA obligations without regard to services for, or investments in, their communities.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Reinvestment_Act

 

http://crisisofcredit.com/

 

George Soros commented on Friday that the world financial system has effectively disintegrated. The turbulence is actually more severe than during the Great Depression, Soros compares the current situation to the demise of the Soviet Union.

At the same conference, former Federal Reserve Chairman Paul Volcker said "I don't remember any time, maybe even in the Great Depression, when things went down quite so fast, quite so uniformly around the world,"

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090221/bs_nm/us_financial_soros

 

i don't think this credit crisis effected to everyone, look one logic.

10 people have 10 homes > if 3 people got bankrupted because of sub prime high risk mortgage that should be collapse > real estate business gone down because for 30% homes for sale home prices down to 50% > balance 7 people who is not bankrupted they don't like to give that home loan return to bank cause they are already gave 50% witch is home price in current market value, so 70% people also just ACTING like bankrupted ... thats why it seems 100% economy crisis.

 

It's relative to the market and when the person purchased the house. In the New York metro, anyone that bought a home in 2001 is still worth 200% of what they paid.

People are not able to borrow against the inflated bubbleprices using home equity loans and that has them crying the blues.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Big-boost-for-housing-cnnm-14417830.html

 

You lot talk as though this is a crisis, as though somthing is wrong with the system or a problem has occured ... lmfao

What you fail to realise is that it has all going exactly as planned. research the Bilderberg goup. tri lateral comission. North American Union And find out exactly what is going on.. Then see if this is a crisis or a pretext to somthing else..

WORLD WAR III (its by design)

 

First there were unredeemed pledges and foreclosed mortgages.
Then came "economic meltdown" and the lighter "economic slowdown".
Now it is whether "recession" of "depression". Are we agreed about
what these terms mean, how are they manifested in our daily lives?
Do we understand each other on the characteristics of each of these
economic maladies? Please distinguish...

 

You are right. Even kissinger (member of the bilderbergs) admitted that obama will help usher in a new world order. The elites have been planning this for many decades.

 

Hmmm...so CRA rules were changed during the Bush administration. Bogart: you didn't reference further information following that portion of a citation from wikipedia......

It would appear that the Bush administration is the group that dramatically changed the character of CRA......opening it up in a way totally 180% from where it had operated.

I suppose one might argue that if CRA had an impact on the financial crisis....(something which facts deny) it was the twisting of CRA by the Bush administration which supplied fuel to the fire.

 

I thought Obama was a Muslim. I thought he was a Communist. I thought he was the anti-Christ. Now I know he's just stupid.

Spend a trillion, then claim you will cut the deficit in half in one term. If I were to call this ignorant phuck a retard, I'd be insulting millions of mentally challenged world wide. He's just stupid. Plain and simple. He's never held a job, he's never run or owned a business. He's been a product of the state and done nothing other than ride the wave of entitlements higher and higher. Now hes gonna save the world by first spending money we do not have, and then taking more away from those that contribute the most to our economy.

I fear Civil War is coming. Not a depression. There's already talk of succession from a few states. Ironic that the man that tried to compare himself to Lincoln, would be the one to usher in a Civil War.

 

Yea, I heard this today too. Didn't make sense that he basically doubled the deficit last week and now he's talking about cutting it in half. Yea right. I don't see him carrying around a magic wand.

And I can't tell you how DISGUSTED I am that he wants to spend craploads more on the foreclosure deal and give MORE money to people that obviously can't figure out how to spend it in the first place. I'm personally insulted that I am a responsible human being that won't do something stupid like qualify for a loan using my DEAD husband's income, and I'm (and my children) getting stuck with the bill. Game over man, game over.

 

What it shows is that he is stupid. Not dumb, not misguided, not uneducated. Just STUPID!

The thing is there are only 5 states int eh union (out of 50) that are in trouble and that are bringing us down. I say tell them all to go to hell, pull all their federal funding and leave them on their own till they figure out how to fix their own messes.

Who'd of thought that Nevada would be the number one foreclosure state, even above Florida. Go figure. Greed capital of the world is number one in foreclosures. Go figure.

And the largest and bluest state in the union with all its money, power and animosity towards morality would be the in that top 5 as well.

Why in the hell should those of us in other states have to bail these luzers out?

This is getting to be ridiculous.

 

Andrew Cuomo used the CRA to push banks to make “affirmative action” subprime loans and Obama sued Citi Bank to make more CRA loans.

The Acorn Mortgage Program

With our program, all steady income counts.

http://www.acornhousing.org/TEXT/homebuying1.php

On the other hand, there was a need for mortgage funding similiar to what Blomberg was doing in New York. Back in the '90s it was really difficult to get funding and small investor groups where buying up small buildings for 100k cash. But the lending should have been done through HUD. The lender's income should have been verified and loans capped at 250k.

You are the "Rick Santelli" of DP

Watch the video
Santelli's Tea Party
CNBC's Rick Santelli and the traders on the floor of the CME Group express outrage over the notion they may have to pay their neighbor's mortgage, particularly if they bought far more house than they could actually afford

http://www.cnbc.com/id/15840232?video=1039849853

 

The debt of the great country of Latvia is now rated junk. Another great country, India, now has a negative outlook and are on the verge of being rated junk.

Commercial real estate is a joke. 2008 was the year of subprime, 2009 will be the year of the CMBS bust.

Fun.

 

IMO, three things are dooming the economy ...

• 2 Wars (Iraq, Afghanistan) and the War on Terror
• a fiat/inflationary monetary system
• an ineffective and out-of-touch political body

 

The war had little if anything to do with this. Hell, the Vietnam War cost more in life and money and we did not have these problems.

The number one problem in the US? CRA Carter/Clinton and the hoard of Pelosis, Reids, Franks, etc., the are out to socialize everything.

Its more than just an out of touch political body. Its a group of people that are hell bent on communizing us. This doom and gloom and spending has been in the works for 30 or more years.

At this point the only thing that can really stop a lot of this is someone silencing Pelosi!

There you go... CRA. Someone gets it.

Gd the irony. Obama was part of the problem long before he ran on the bs platform that he'd be part of the solution.

What a shitbag.

This guy knows where its at. That's the way nearly every American feels right now. And on CNBC to boot.