What is the relevance? The text mostly is about pagans and idol worshipers that has got nothing to do with Jews but I don't expect Corporal potato to know that. Here are the definition from dictionary. Pagan: 1:a follower of a polytheistic religion (as in ancient Rome) 2: one who has little or no religion and who delights in sensual pleasures and material Idolater: 1 : a worshiper of idols 2 : a person that admires intensely and often blindly one that is not usually a subject of worship I don't believe Jews would like to be considered pagan or idolaters. Bible has it own share of antisemitism too. Both Koran and Bible are old books that have very little relevance to today events. People don't fight each other because of religion, they fight because of the reality of their life. If religion had any strong significance in daily life, American would still consider the Jews the Christ killer and in the same category as blacks and dogs but instead you see people like Gtech, bograt,... who are ready to sell their country for the sake of Israel, because that is what neo-cons have thought them during the last 30 years.
The information that Gtech described as "you should not expect to get wilingly from me, gworld, iggs and others" have been already provided on these forums several times, I will gladly repeat again for the ones who missed them, in several posts, and they can also do a search and find them, I will start with the verse 005.051 - 52 SHAKIR: O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people. which Gtech quoted, first the word "SHAKIR" there is the name of the person who translated it from Arabic, to English, in Gtech quotes you will notice that he quotes this translator only most of the time, except when he finds a translation that is closer to what fits his agenda, then he will use it, as when he quoted Yusuf Ali in verse 9:05 the 3 translations there says: Quran was revealed in Arabic, friends in Arabic means Asdiqa'a, the word that has been translated to "friends", or to "friends and protectors" in the above 3 translations is Awliya in some other translations its translated as "allies" like in this example: which is close to the meaning of "friends and protectors" in YUSUFALI which of course Gtech did not quote, but what does Awliya mean? the answer can be found here a quote from the above link: this can be confirmed from the Quran itself in other places where the same word is used, also where other verses describe the relation between Muslims and non-Muslims, of these:
I'm asking you because you're the one who asked "what does Muslim scripture have to say about Jews?" thus apparently presupposing that it might, or should, say something about them when the reality is that in fact there's absolutely no reason why it should at all.
following the previous post, here are some historical facts about how these Quranic teachings been implemented: when comparing this with the following quote from the Jewish-authorized Babylonian Talmud, I wonder why Gtech has nothing to say about this: when I compare this with this another quote from the Jewish-authorized Babylonian Talmud, I wonder, did Gtech read it? compare this to: would love to hear what Gtech has to say about the previous quote.
Couple of things to point out. 1) Let's start with gworld's, because it's so weak and futile an effort, that it can quickly be dismissed as the rantings of someone who only attended collage. http://www.readingislam.com/servlet...sh-AAbout_Islam/AskAboutIslamE/AskAboutIslamE So that corrects the record, as usual, with his drivel. 2) The "translation card" that imad uses, is quite a common tactic in dissimulation. Note that he doesn't directly deny the scriptures or their meaning, but rather points out that there are multiple translations. What he doesn't point out (and I don't blame him, because it's pointless) is that they have the same meaning. These are islamic scholars that are accepted translations. Ironically, the scriptures above, I simply re-introduced from a previous thread where a dissimulator was trying the very same tactics. Note, that during that discussion with an islamic dissimulator, he was using the shakir verses to attempt to prove a point, so during that discussion, I focused on those specific translations. However, the others are still at the source. This leads us to the next tactic, which is also easy to spot, if you've been around long enough. Abrogation. imad, would you like to explain abrogation, or would you like me to chime in on this one as well? This tactic involves a non-denial of critical verses that clearly show what islam is about, and instead goes back to reference other verses that show a kinder/gentler islam. The intent here is to say "those verses can't be valid, because these verses say different." It's an interesting tactic, because on one hand, it shows just how full of contradictions the quranic verses are, but more importantly, it misleads the casual infidel into a state of confusion and wondering what is what. imad should be able to give us a lesson on what abrogation is, the importance of the order of the verses by date (not chronological order) and why those bad verses abrogate those early verses. Though, somehow, I suspect he'd rather I didn't bring this issue up. imad, you have the floor.
In islamic countries, muslims and jews ( native jews not jews from all over the world ) are living side by side for thousands of years. jews in Tunisia: The war in middle east is not between muslims and jews
Do you have a problem when Muslims want to move to other countries? Many countries now host many new Muslim immigrants - should they be welcomed or not? Are you against all immigrants or just Jewish ones? It is really sad that you can't just say Jews and Muslims can live side by side together and have to qualify it in some way.
the three translations you provided, two of them used "friends" and one used "friends and protectors" and I provided you with a forth one that use the word "allies" and there are of course other translations, not only to English, but almost to every living language, I also gave you the original word in Arabic that was in that verse, which is "Awliya" readers can do a research or ask somebody who speaks both Arabic and English for its meaning, so if you insist that patrons and friends are the same, that's up to you, i do not blame you I also provided you with real historical examples, from both Christians and Muslims, which makes the person wonder, if its true as Gtech say that Muslims should not take Christians or Jews as friends, then why they are taking them as friends in real life? there are so many examples, old and new, here is another recent and real example from my country, in addition to the one TeliaSonera provided you from Tunisia: source this same funny article you posted about abrogations, been refuted in details, here is the link
Thank you for helping Gtech and browntwn to become less ignorant, please do not let browntwn scare you, he does this always with anybody who tries to teach him what he failed to learn, and he gets like this when he learn something new, he finds it hard to admit he was ignorant, and always try to imply weird things, like in his post: he is trying to imply that Jews in Islamic countries can't travel, and that Muslims treat Jews badly, as if he does not know already that there are many Jews who are against Zionism and Israel because it effected negatively that good relation they had for hundreds of years: source
Umm.. Ok! You may have wanted to read the posts in this thread that answered the question. Or you could get your post count up by posting more argumentative babble. Whichever one works for you. @ everyone else. Thanks for the discussion, I'm trying to follow.
I will one more time repeat your own words which make you what you really are, a sissy: Put up or shut up.
While "rabbi" corporal potato wants to make Judaism to something which is not and classify it as idolater religion and pagans, let look at what real Jews say about it. Source But what do these people know? They are just leaders of Jewish community and they can not compare themselves with Corporal potato, the leader of missing balls chicken brigade. The truth is that Judaism and Islam are very similar and have a common root (from food to laws and traditions) and the odd man out between the three religion is actually Christianity. But this is not something that neo-cons would like you to know. How can they ask American Christians to sell their country for the sake of Israel while telling them they consider Christ a false profit?
When you move at least, buy a house, a land .... not taking other's territories with military force OK ... Tomorrow I'll be your guest and I'll take your house for free then we can live side by side we're going to spend a good time together ...EnJoY
God you are dumb. That is not at all what I said or what I was implying. I was saying exactly what I said. Which is he seemed to be saying that Jews are okay as long as they are not new immigrants to Muslims lands. That he can only live peacefully with the Jews that were already there. So I asked him the question about Muslims who are moving all over Europe. Should they be welcomed into France and Italy, etc. Or should the French and Italians take the same attitude that he takes to Jews, namely, that the Muslims who have always been in France are okay, but new ones coming from all over the world are the cause of problems. It was his obvious disdain for Jews, as though they are somehow different from everyone else, that came through in his post - in spite of the message he was trying to convey. I think you are just incapable of comprehending a simple post without trying to infer all types of hatred, because that it what you have in your heart.
sorry to disappoint you, you are the dumb one, and this is not new, you should start getting used on being dumb, and on being treated like a dumb, and join Gtech & Mia's brigade. you while playing dumb, or by being really dumb, or both - you compared an immigration that is allowed by the destination countries, and that is not concentrated on one country for the purpose to change it demographically then steal it, by an illegal immigration that been opposed by the destination country and the neighbor countries, and that was concentrated on one country to change its demography and later steal it. you should get it, its not about them being Jews, be they Jews, or Red Indians, or Europeans, or Africans, or Polar Bears.... Arabs do not like foreigners who come to steal their lands or sources, so of course they have problems with foreign Jews, but again, not because they are Jews, its because they are thieves, terrorists, assassins.. source - As Arabs see the Jews I must though admit that I misunderstood part of your post, in not allowing Jews to travel freely, since you implied this before in a different case where Jews live in another Islamic country ( Iran), but even now after I fully understood your post, it got worse, and I explained it above, so, sorry for me not taking your posts with full seriousness anymore because they are not based on facts, or truth, or clear understanding to the conflict or its history.