Hi all, One of my campaigns has 30 or more adgroups. Conversions = registrations for us and each adgroup takes the user to a different landing page and then onto a centralised registration page (or 2). We're offering prize draws for each landing page and the prizes are quite substantial...cars, electronic equipment, top brands and so on. Well first I've had the problem of trademark violations. e.g. I had to get rid of ipod and tried iipod (genius, I know) which worked for a few days until it was manually reviewed and banned. I know that I have to come up with better creatives for my ads and that's something I'm resigned to. What's really of concern though, is that for many of these adgroups, no keywords are available at all. I'm outbid on every one I try . I've tried the Site-Related Keywords tool and even these keywords are too expensive. You see, we're aiming for < 50p a conversion (Americans think 50 cents). Most of the keywords start at 50 per click and some go up to £5 (Americans think $5). Am i just in a situation where our cost per conversion is too low to use PPC for these incentives? Thanks in advance Joe
It's very difficult to get conversions for less than £0.50 each, regardless of what you're doing. This is a downside to PPC advertising in general. Even if you can get a 10% conversion rate, you still have to pay for 10 clicks for each conversion. And to get a low minimum bid you need a very good Quality Score, so you need a high clickthrough rate. There aren't many campaigns out there with a high CTR, high conversion rate, low cost per click and significant volumes of traffic. However, from your message, I'm guessing that your minimum bids are too high. These are not fixed - they vary depending on your Minimum Bid Quality Score. This is a value that Google calculates based on how much it really wants your advert to appear - specifically, is it what people are looking for, and are you reputable? To get a minimum bid of £5, your website needs to be a problem. You need to add things like a privacy policy to engender trust. You also need to get a good clickthrough rate - do that, and Google will gradually reduce your minimum bids. But I doubt you'll ever be able to get conversions at the sort of price that you're looking at...
The user mostly wont signup for a prize draw, (there are infinity prize draw sites out there) What Theme is your site about., If your site already has a brand, site draw will surely get attraction, if not, i think it wont get good conversions., but user may click the ad that contains prize draw, but when he reaches the site he may think its just one of the many other prize draw sites that wont send the prize or may think it as a fake, First building trust is important., But anyways if your goal is to increase conversions through prize draw schemes, Focus On 1) Wether your landing page is short? 2) Whether it requires more than one page of form filling?, 3) Wether the landing page is optimized for the keyword that you have in your adgroups 4)Whether the ad is properly themed to the group of keywords in the adgroup 5) Whether you have a themed adgroup containing themed keywords related to that adgroup? Try to do all these, also try to include the keyword in the display url
Thanks for the detailed reply. I'm sorry to contradict you, but we are converting well. When I arrived at the company we were getting around a 100 conversions per day, at less than 50 pence...promise. Also, from my short experience, I really don't think this is a quality score issue. I think I'm being outbid by people who's conversions are worth a whole lot more than we are willing to bid...e.g. cars etc. i.e. If i'm selling a car, or a holiday (Americans see 'vacation', I'm going to be happy to bid £5, since the ROI will still be ok. I really do not think it's a quality score issue. It's a bidding issue. I have to say I got slightly confused in my last post. We were formerly getting conversions on quiz sites that had a prize draw as well as a cash prize. The campaign in question is a pure prize draw in exchange for registration data. Still, the quality of the prizes makes me sure it's a bidding issue. What do you guys think of that? Thanks again
I'm looking in one particular adgroup and you're all correct in one sense...the quality score is poor. However, there's a massive leap from my maximum cost per click rate of < 10 pence to £5 and I don't think the quality score is pushing it up that far. I have other keywords that have poor quality scores in other adgroups and they're often much cheaper. I see no reason why the quality score in the given adgroup should make my keywords so much more expensive than in other cases. The common theme in this campaign is expensive prizes. Why do none of you factor in the bidding in this discussion at all? I understand that QS is important but it's an auction. None of you have even mentioned the possibility that I'm being outbid... Thanks anyway
I can't install any photo editing software and can't get a screenshot under 90K so I'm gonna paste the keyword list and hope for the best. I'll give an example of the ad text without the urls... Win a HD Ready Samsung 32 Integrated Digital Tuner Nicam and Trusurround Technology! In this case I admit the ad creative needs some work (no call to action etc). If any of you can try to use these keywords just to check the bidding price I'd be grateful... What you can see is that there is a great deal of variance between these keywords in term of the amount of bidding needed to start triggering ads. 25p to £5. Some of the £5 keywords seem more relevant to me than some of the 25p ones! Anyway, thanks again. 1080p hdtv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 19 widescreen high definition lcd tv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 20 widescreen high definition lcd tv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 26 hdtv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 26 high definition digital lcd tv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 26 high definition ready lcd tv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.25 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.25 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 27 high definition lcd tv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 32 Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 32 hdtv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.20 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.20 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 32 high definition digital lcd tv 787548 Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.20 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.20 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 32 high definition lcd tv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.25 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.25 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 32 high definition ready lcd tv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.25 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.25 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 32 high definition tv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.20 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.20 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 32 high definition widescreen lcd tv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 37 hdtv Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00
Forget about the competitor outbidding you., First focus on getting the "Great" Quality score for most of your keywords., How have you grouped the Keywords? Seeing these keywords: "high definition widescreen lcd tv " "high definition digital lcd" high definition lcd tv etc., Group your adgroups like: 1) High Definition Tv 2)high definition Digital lcd tv 3) high definition widescreen lcd tv 4) Creating landing page based on the themed adgroup containing the main keyword of that group have ads created based on these theme and add keywords based on the above them., You wil surely get a great quality score., You also must have ads that contains call to action Normally, i use (advice my subordinates too) to allocate the third line for call to action
How can you say that your minimum bids aren't a Quality Score issue? Nothing that your competitors do has any bearing on your minimum bids. Your minimum bid is based (principally) on Your website Your clickthrough rate Your advert text (does it relate to the keyword) In order to get minimum bids this high, the problem isn't the last two - it's almost certainly the website. Google doesn't like your website. Without seeing it, it's difficult to say why, exactly, but here's Google's guidelines to what they like. http://adwords.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answer=47884
Regarding the landing pages. Google may not like them but users do! The conversion rates we have are very respectable indeed. I'm deliberating over the idea of posting a link to one of our landing pages. Not sure if it's a good idea yet... Joe
That's up to you. If Google is your main source of traffic, then you'll have to change your page if you want to tap into it. If it isn't, then set up a new page just for Google to land on.
Ok guys, take a look at this. Creative: Win an LG Prada phone The size of a credit card Highly sort-after designer phone Keyword List: win a phone Active OK Minimum bid: £0.05 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 LG mobile phone Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 LG phone Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 designer mobile phone Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 designer phone Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 designer phones Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.15 to activate OK Minimum bid: £0.15 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a mobile Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.10 to activate OK Minimum bid: £0.10 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a mobile phone Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.25 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.25 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a mobile phone competition Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a new mobile phone Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a new phone Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.25 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.25 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 Spider view of web page: Spidered Text : Win an LG Prada mobile phone Win an LG Prada mobile phone Closing Date: 13 Mar 2008 Terms & Conditions LG has created currently one of the most sort-after designer phones � the Prada phone.The size of a credit card, you can easily slip this phone in your pocket or a bag. With its state of the art touch-screen, exclusive Saffiano leather case and Prada earphones, everybody who�s anybody has this sleek, stylish phone.Just complete the questions below for your prize draw entry. EXISTING USER? Log in here. Email: Password: Remember Me Forget Me << What is this? Forgotten your password? NEW USER? You need to register with Vouch4me to gain full access, enter prize draws and claim FREE vouchers. � Vouch4me 2004 - 2007 Win prizes in our online competitions and claim free vouchers Meta Keywords : win phone mobile LG prada Meta Description : win a phone, win a mobile phone, win a LG phone, win a LG mobile phone, win a Prada phone, win a Prada mobile phone, win a LG Prada phone, win a LG Prada mobile phone Now tell me it's my quality score... Joe
Another example... Creative: Win break for 2 in Paris Head off in style on the Eurostar Enter our free draw now! Keywords: competitions Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 competitions to win holidays Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 travel prizes Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a city break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a hotel break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a short break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a weekend break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win hotel break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 Landing page: Spidered Text : Win a Weekend Break for 2 to Paris Win a Weekend Break for 2 to Paris Closing Date: 07 Oct 2007 Terms & Conditions Head off in style on the Eurostar to one of the most romantic cities in the world. Start your weekend break for 2 relaxing on the Eurostar as you head across the channel and into Paris. Once there you are free to enjoy all the sites that this famous city has to offer: the Eiffel Tower, Le Louvre, Sacre Coeur. When your weekends over the Eurostar will have you home in no-time. For your chance to win just answer the following questions. EXISTING USER? Log in here. Email: Password: Remember Me Forget Me << What is this? Forgotten your password? NEW USER? You need to register with Vouch4me to gain full access, enter prize draws and claim FREE vouchers. © Vouch4me 2004 - 2007 Win prizes in our online competitions and claim free vouchers Meta Keywords : win holiday trip break Paris Meta Description : win a holiday, win a trip, win a break, win a trip to Paris, win a break to Paris, win a weekend break to Paris, win a break for 2 to Paris, win a weekend break for 2 to Paris
Another example... Creative: Win break for 2 in Paris Head off in style on the Eurostar Enter our free draw now! Keywords: competitions Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 competitions to win holidays Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 travel prizes Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £5.00 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £5.00 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a city break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a hotel break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a short break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win a weekend break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 win hotel break Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £0.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £0.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 Landing page: Spidered Text : Win a Weekend Break for 2 to Paris Win a Weekend Break for 2 to Paris Closing Date: 07 Oct 2007 Terms & Conditions Head off in style on the Eurostar to one of the most romantic cities in the world. Start your weekend break for 2 relaxing on the Eurostar as you head across the channel and into Paris. Once there you are free to enjoy all the sites that this famous city has to offer: the Eiffel Tower, Le Louvre, Sacre Coeur. When your weekends over the Eurostar will have you home in no-time. For your chance to win just answer the following questions. EXISTING USER? Log in here. Email: Password: Remember Me Forget Me << What is this? Forgotten your password? NEW USER? You need to register with Vouch4me to gain full access, enter prize draws and claim FREE vouchers. © Vouch4me 2004 - 2007 Win prizes in our online competitions and claim free vouchers Meta Keywords : win holiday trip break Paris Meta Description : win a holiday, win a trip, win a break, win a trip to Paris, win a break to Paris, win a weekend break to Paris, win a break for 2 to Paris, win a weekend break for 2 to Paris
This example is of an adgroup that is working well. Creative: Eastenders Quiz Test your "Eastenders" knowledge Reach level 2 and win £5 Eastenders Active £0.15 Settings £0.15 Max CPC [ Edit ] 2,156 106,527 2.02% £0.15 £322.13 1.4 13.03% £1.15 eastenders quiz Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 41 456 8.99% £0.04 £1.72 4.0 2.44% £1.72 www eastenders co uk Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 13 344 3.77% £0.03 £0.33 3.7 7.69% £0.33 dawn eastenders Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 1 296 0.33% £0.05 £0.05 1.2 100.00% £0.05 Eastenders news Active £0.08 Settings £0.08 Max CPC [ Edit ] 4 257 1.55% £0.08 £0.32 2.0 25.00% £0.32 eastenders com Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 15 251 5.97% £0.04 £0.61 3.0 13.33% £0.31 bbc co uk eastenders Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 9 163 5.52% £0.03 £0.27 1.7 22.22% £0.14 Eastenders update Active £0.08 Settings £0.08 Max CPC [ Edit ] 1 118 0.84% £0.08 £0.08 2.4 0.00% £0.00 watch eastenders online Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 0 87 0.00% - - 4.2 0.00% £0.00 watch eastenders Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 1 68 1.47% £0.05 £0.05 2.8 0.00% £0.00 eastenders theme Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 0 31 0.00% - - 1.0 0.00% £0.00 bradley eastenders Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 0 21 0.00% - - 1.2 0.00% £0.00 eastenders pictures Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 0 16 0.00% - - 4.9 0.00% £0.00 eastenders video Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 0 14 0.00% - - 4.1 0.00% £0.00 free Eastenders quiz Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 0 6 0.00% - - 5.4 0.00% £0.00 eastenders fun games Active £0.06 Settings Default Max CPC [ Edit ] 0 1 0.00% - - 1.0 0.00% £0.00 Website: Spidered Text : So You Think You Know Eastenders Free fun to play Eastenders quiz with the chance to win some great prizes along the way. Only the most die-hard fans will manage to top the leaderboard. Can you? 1. G . Ward - West Midlands 2. M . Perry - South Yorkshire 3. N . Wood - Nottinghamshire 4. S . Finn - Somerset 5. D . Carter-Leay - Ranelagh view complete leaderboard General Knowledge Films Music TV Food Coronation Street Football PubQuiz Celebrities Soaps ShowBiz Golf Formula One Rugby Union Sport Horse Racing Tennis Rugby League Cricket Cricket World Cup Six Nations Rugby Im A Celebrity Celebrity Big Brother X-Factor Scottish Football World Cup Big Brother Champions League game rules | high scores | winners | add a question | privacy policy | affiliates | about us | links | quiz portal | questions Win a Beauty Party Pack with GHD MK4 Styler and much much more Win an Audi A3. Someones going to win it, why not you? Win the Ultimate home Theatre Package, including HD tv plus PS3 Meta Keywords : eastenders quiz bbc eastenders walford queen vic eastenders eastenders update Meta Description : Free fun to play Eastenders quiz with the chance to win some great prizes along the way. Only the most die-hard fans will manage to top the leaderboard. Can you? N.B. Eastenders is a UK soap opera. You cannot buy a soap opera as far as I know. Nor can you give one away in a competition. Therefore, it's supportive of my argument that bidding is the problem and not the quality score. Optically, I don't see how this list of keywords should yield a better quality score than in the former examples. Do you agree?
Let's look at a detailed example... Keyword : LG mobile phone Inactive for search Increase quality or bid £2.50 to activate Poor Minimum bid: £2.50 £0.06 0 0 - - - - 0.00% £0.00 This keyword is in both the creative and the landing page. Why is it's quality score so bad?
Your minimum bid is calculated entirely from your Minimum Bid Quality Score. That's how it works. The higher your MBQS, the less your minimum bid is. If you have a high minimum bid, you have a low Minimum Bid Quality Score. If you have a low minimum bid, you have a high Minimum Bid Quality Score. That's what the Minimum Bid Quality Score does. Here's where Google explains how the Minimum Bid is calculated: https://adwords.google.com/support/...1377&query=minimum+bid&topic=&type=f&onClick= Note the first lines "A keyword's minimum bid is determined by its Quality Score. If you're trying to run your ad on a keyword with a high minimum bid, try increasing the keyword's Quality Score to reduce its minimum bid".
CustardMite, I ask you to look at the data I provided and tell me how you'd make the quality score any better... I can see that you're an expert on PPC, so I'm not trying to be argumentative. However, isn't the price that others are willing to bid for a given keyword at least as important as the QS? The person who trained me in my last role suggested that the QS might take the cpc down by a factor of 5, but I'm looking to take it down by around a factor of 50. Again, how would you improve the quality score in the examples above, given that some of the keywords that are considered to have a poor quality score are both in the creatives and the landing page. Thanks Joe
Another example. Keyword: Kerastase Active OK Minimum bid: £0.08 Why is this keyword only 'OK', considering that it's in both the ad text and the landing page? Why isn't it 'Great'?
Another example, this time showing a keyword with a Great quality score that is NOT in the landing page OR ad text AT ALL. Keyword: win a prize Active Great Minimum bid: £0.03