required reciprocal link...good or bad?

[The Club Crawler]

I am just curious about if a required reciprocal link is a good or bad idea in your opinion?
If you dont charge for listing in a directory is it unreasonable to require a link back, or is it better to ask for one and leave it up to the submitee?

Also how useful are reciprocal links in the serps?

[jg123]

I would say bad and a complete waste, too many scammers out there that will put your link up then take it down or put it on non-indexed pages. Plus recip links are frowned upon big time by some search engines.

[The Club Crawler]

so it would be better to just offer free listings?

[sray]

Reciprocal Links are not good in google's eyes. Also its useless if the page(where your link is placed) is not indexed & have many obls.

so it would be better to just offer free listings?
Yeah, or you can charge a small amount, but if your directory is new, better offer free listings. For paid reviews you have to advertise, market, promote your directory a lot.

[swedal]

I don't even have the recip option on my site - there are many reasons it is a bad idea.

[Jim4767]

As a regular submitter to directories, here's my personal approach to it:

• I submit regularly to free directories without a recip requirement.
• I submit occasionally to paid directories that I consider to offer some value.
• I never (not one time ever) submit to directories requiring a recip link, for various reasons, including:
(1) My link to the directory will almost inevitably be higher PR than their link to me. I would be giving them far more value than they would be giving me.
(2) I don't want to be caught linking to bad neighborhoods. I can guarantee the quality of my site, but not of theirs.
(3) My website's policy for outgoing links is to link only to those websites in my niche and in whom I have confidence. Usually I have had a historical working relationship with the website owner(s). I have zero confidence in a website whose owner I do not know. He/she may be a fine person (or maybe not :mad:), and next week or month that domain might be sold and turned into a porn site with my website unwittingly linking to it!

In sum, my personal policy is to stay away from reciprocal links, other than to websites whose owners I know personally and trust totally.

[kevster1]

I'd say bad also.

As Jim says I get regularly around 50-100 submissions a day at one of my directories and if I turn that directories reciprocal link on it drops within a day to 0-1 submissions.

If your looking to build links I would avoid.

[pipes]

I just removed the reciprocal option from all of my directories within the last week or so, i was going to do it some time ago, it can be more hassle than its worth.

[hotpop]

Required reciprocal link is only good for traffic. Not any benefit for SEPS and PR.
The reciprocal option has been removed from most of directories .

[mikey1090]

I think Jim made an excellent summary. To add to what he said, gone are the days when a webmaster will provide you with a genuine backlink. It will come from a link farm or an unindexed page.

Not to mention the fact that all the reciprocal links will be from unrelated sites.

[The Club Crawler]

Thank you all so much The reciprocal link thing on my submit form is now optional,which makes my dir completely free now. I really am stoked for all the quality feedback and information...Now all I have to do is try and get some submissions!
Working hard, but you all are a real big help...Thanx again!

[JamieG]

Didn't Matt Cutts mention something about being against reciprocals?

[mikey1090]

Yes he did Jamie. Link exchanging is done to manipulate google rankings which they obviously don't like.

[pipes]

Yes he did Jamie. Link exchanging is done to manipulate google rankings which they obviously don't like.

Reciprocal links would almost never give benefit to a directory with the places they are usually placed.

I would say that link exchanging doesn't manipulate google rankings anywhere near as much as other things, for example sponsoring templates.

Link exchanges with a relevant site is not wrong, providing a relevant link to your visitors makes sense, a few swapped links is fine, its when you do it on a non relevant or large scale.

[swedal]

Thank you all so much The reciprocal link thing on my submit form is now optional,which makes my dir completely free now. I really am stoked for all the quality feedback and information...Now all I have to do is try and get some submissions!
Working hard, but you all are a real big help...Thanx again!

I doubt very much that anyone will ever voluntarily give you a reicprocal link - you are better off removing the option entirely from your submit page. If you want just customize your confirmation email to ask them for the recip there.

People at google have made comments that lead me to believe they have no idea how that recip feature works and may be mis interpreting it as being required and then punishing the site. I think it is somewhere in the comments of this post (http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2007/12/information-about-buying-and-selling.html) if you want to read through all that. Best not to have it there at all.

at least imo

[msolution]

Jim said it all!

at any given day theres more of a chance of u getting a reci link from a link.php which will have 500 more links, than someone giving u a link from a decent page!

M.

[SeoTrade]

I would say bad also and agree totally with comment from Jim4767.

This is my unique directory ( http://www.opendirectorio.com/ ), it's like my little girl, it's absolutely free and no reciprocal is required, however I always hope that kind people will place a reciprocal on their site. (unfortunately only 2% of people are kind), but I think it's a good practice.

I invite you all to submit your quality websites. ;)

[Artifexus]

I doubt very much that anyone will ever voluntarily give you a reicprocal link

Actually, I have a recip option on a niche directory, and I'm actually getting recips, from about 5-10% of the small number of sites that have submitted. It's free to submit without a recip and a recip is not required. 1/2 or a 1/3 of those are from homepages.

It seems that there's a higher percentage of sites that I reject that have included a recip - I think they think that a recip gets them a better chance of getting in the directory.

And as far as recips being bad for serps, I challenge that assertion:

www.freeindex.co.uk :
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&suggon=0&q=UK+business+directory
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&suggon=0&q=free+UK+business+directory&btnG=Search

www.justrealestate.org :
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&suggon=0&q=real+estate+directory

Edit: Oh, and www.real-estate-blogs.com :
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&suggon=0&q=real+estate+blogs

[swedal]

Allright i dug through that post (http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2007/12/information-about-buying-and-selling.html) and found the comment by Matt Cutts on Dec 3, 2007 10:30 PM Where he posted

"And there's the fact that every url submission has that "reciprocal url" field. If you can't see any difference between that and Yahoo, then we'll just have to agree not to see eye to eye."

When discussing a directory that was penalized.

[JamieG]

Allright i dug through that post (http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2007/12/information-about-buying-and-selling.html) and found the comment by Matt Cutts on Dec 3, 2007 10:30 PM Where he posted

"And there's the fact that every url submission has that "reciprocal url" field. If you can't see any difference between that and Yahoo, then we'll just have to agree not to see eye to eye."

When discussing a directory that was penalized.Good post swedal, I looked into one of the links which was clear as day to me.

http://www.google.com/support/webmasters/bin/answer.py?answer=66356

This is in violation of Google's webmaster guidelines and can negatively impact your site's ranking in search results. Examples of link schemes can include:

* Links intended to manipulate PageRank
* Links to web spammers or bad neighborhoods on the web
* Excessive reciprocal links or excessive link exchanging ("Link to me and I'll link to you.")
* Buying or selling links that pass PageRank

Think that sums it up?

[swedal]

Good post swedal, I looked into one of the links which was clear as day to me.

Think that sums it up?

Yeah JamieG and the thing that really summed it up for me and made me take off any kind of recip option from my site is that the directory he was talking about did not require a recip - it was a voluntary recip...

[Artifexus]

Yeah JamieG and the thing that really summed it up for me and made me take off any kind of recip option from my site is that the directory he was talking about did not require a recip - it was a voluntary recip...

But then why do the directories above rank so well???

Both www.justrealestate.org and www.real-estate-blogs.com require a recip before inclusion.

http://www.real-estate-blogs.com/blogs/addlisting.php
http://www.justrealestate.org/addweb.asp?dir=/usa

Neither are more than 4 years old (justrealestate barely 4 years), so it's not like they are ancient sites getting free passes for old recips. Both are PR5.

With freeindex.co.uk, you get an upgraded listing if you recip them. I don't know exactly what they get, i think you can include product info and such, but i don't know for sure. I don't know if you get preferred placement or what not. But in this directory's instance, it's an option (might be required to get the actual link in the listing though, vs. just a plain text spot). It's a PR6 under 4 years old.

What the hell? :confused: :mad:

[Artifexus]

From: http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2007/12/information-about-buying-and-selling.html

Is this true?:

"Matt Cutts said...
"Simple question Matt (I expect a simple answer) Why did you penalized AliveDirectory.com ? Have you ever browsed that directory? Ten times more quality than Yahoo directory!"

MLP, I browsed for a couple minutes and noticed that at http://www.alivedirectory.com/submit.php
they appear to require a reciprocal link with every submission. I haven't seen that many directories that *require* you to link to them when you submit a url."

[swedal]

Artifexus - Only one company can answer your questions as good as they are...

[Artifexus]

Artifexus - Only one company can answer your questions as good as they are...

Haha, well, I do know that Bruce. My questions are half rhetorical, as I mainly wanted to point out examples that contradict what was stated about recips. I acknowledge, however, that scroogle's guidelines DO say to avoid excessive reciprical linking, so I really do wonder about those results...

[Kraize]

Recip link directories are basically pointless. The majority won't submit to your directory if you required a recip and if they do it will be from an indexed page like links23423.html

[The Club Crawler]

one point i thought of, sites like blogcatalog for example require you ad their link in oder to validate. why are they not penalized? since i changed the recip to an option i received 9 quality submissions, of which 3 pr4 blogs added my banner. these sites are in my niche so i see nothing but good coming from that.

[Artifexus]

one point i thought of, sites like blogcatalog for example require you ad their link in oder to validate. why are they not penalized?

This was my point earlier! I pointed out three directories that do well based on mandatory/optional recipocal linking. I really just don't understand it. Scroogle says one thing, but enforces selectively.

since i changed the recip to an option i received 9 quality submissions, of which 3 pr4 blogs added my banner. these sites are in my niche so i see nothing but good coming from that.

I mentioned roughly the same thing, too. I think it may depend on being niche vs general - I imagine being niche makes it easier to link to. You've also got an original directory, so you may be attracting some interest and people are more willing to link to you. Certainly doesn't hurt to get related backlinks!

[The Club Crawler]

I have completely removed the recip section from my submit form, now it is a "where did you find me?" question which I think will be far more useful in analyzing my promotional campaign. The advice you all gave me was a wake up call, thanks for the tips before I got burnt!

[hamster01]

I'd rather pay for submission instead of giving the directory reciprocial link.

[pipes]

I have completely removed the recip section from my submit form, now it is a "where did you find me?" question which I think will be far more useful in analyzing my promotional campaign. The advice you all gave me was a wake up call, thanks for the tips before I got burnt!

Fortunately from all the crap that a lot of us have experienced and learned from its handy for yourself and others as you can avoid a lot of what can be a few headaches and benefit from it all.

[w3bmaster]

Very bad i just pass directorys that asck reciprocal links

[The Club Crawler]

Yeah it is so true! recips are evil, and I no longer offer them, I mean The link code is there, but I could care less if it is used. truth be told I am hell drunk now, been out all night and cant sleep so here I am posting rants and raves to all my subscribed threads that have been commented on since last log in. please disregard everything I post on april 7th 2008 hahaha. I think I will log out now before I am de rep'd to death. though I do appreciate all the great advice and feedback I have received since joining DP forums. you are all stars!

[Event_King]

I don't want to be caught linking to bad neighborhoods

Yes, this scares me. Now I never bother with recip directories - pointless exercise and a waste of valuable time.

[maldives]

Complete waste of time. I would stay away from reciprocal directories.

[johncena000]

It's just time waste for visitors.