What should I download to build my own website

[44Reasons]

Hey peeps,just made the final decision to be a penny pincher,so in short I want to download a free program that will make my job easier,or until I really know enough to be able to throw 150+ on a professionally built website.

I am currently Pre W3 school(been BSin alot,yeah I know thats bad) and will eventually be focusing more on my work this week.I know that before I focus on adwords,PPC or landing pages(money) I will have to really know the basics or my whole foundation will fall.

Please help...thx 44:cool:

[Ali Razaqpur]

Just use a cms, like Joomla or PHP-Fusion.

[lslars31]

A free program to help you code websites? Like a WYSIWYG? I would recommend Dreamweaver although I have never used it, a lot of people seem to like it. I code everything by hand :)

[Ali Razaqpur]

Oh something like that yeah use Dreamweaver it's really good

[AstarothSolutions]

Other than dreamweaver isnt free?

For true penny pinching use notepad

[jbladeus]

Try Aptana Studio (http://www.aptana.com/studio).
Hands down the best free DW alternative (sort of) out there.

[St. Anger]

use notepad if u cant purchase dreamweaver :D

[nagendra]

try dream weaver its better to create a new website

[John M.]

Wow, i am sorry no one with insight has really helped you much.
First off, if you buy dreamweaver, you'll want photoshop, and if you want photoshop you'll want illustartor. Your not talking $150 your talking $1400-2000.
Anyways you need to learn alot more than just that to build a website.

But for coding use http://nvudev.com/screenshots.php for design get gimp with http://www.gimpshop.com/ plugin installed that way when you transfer to photoshop your not compleatly screwed.

- John

[sivle]

Honestly, if you're money concioius, and without software, I would just turn to a good host provider, assuming you're not doing this yourself. There are many that offer free templates (usually thousands to choose from) and a WSIWYG editor to boot. I have chosen one that offers these tools, and it only cost me around 10 bucks to get started. Granted, this is a monthly fee, but much better than the hundreds or thousands you'd have to pay for software just to get started. If you want me to give you a good host let me know...I didn't want to post their name here as I wasn't sure if that was allowed.

[lslars31]

Yea I was a notepad user when I was on Windows. Can't go wrong with that, only for the true hand coder though. :) Which I do suggest you learn at some point if you haven't already.

[TechnoGeek]

You may want to try

CoffeeCup Free Editor (http://www.coffeecup.com/free-editor/)

or

AceHtml Free Editor (http://software.visicommedia.com/en/products/acehtmlfreeware/)

[chopsticks]

For basics though when you want to learn to code or are new to it Dreamweaver works well in creating basic sites and or creating more complex ones with the designs they have accompanied with it. It does help with faster deployment with sites but it can be a little expensive. I also used Frontpage too (names changed now I think) but mainly for it's code highlighting users back in the day. Frontpage seemed to add unnecessary code to the document which I didn't like.

Notepad is good for coding but it'd probably be better to try something with a code highlighter as it makes things significantly easier. For that i'd recommend ConText as it's always worked well for me whenever I code.

I'd say the best path (and quite slow, but what I eventually did) would be to just focus more on learning html and css to a point where you can create all your sites from scratch. But till then something such as editing open source or free templates should suit you well as it's very simple and it'll improve your understanding of it all. Check out the OSWD (http://www.oswd.org/) website for some templates to suit your page style if you want to take that path.

[44Reasons]

Thx for all the replies people,I really appreciate it......

Please keep em coming,and feel free to add anything that has not yet been added.Cause I will definitely be coming back to this thread lol.....

Thx 44

[Yankee4Life]

It gets pricey. It really pays off to have Dreamweaver, Photoshop & Illustrator.

[DJinBoise]

Try CNET's Download.com to try out different software. You'll find reviews of many different choices of software from Free to Try and Buy.

Follow the menu and look for Website Creation tools.
Download > Windows > Developer Tools > Web Page Creation

DJ
Boise, ID

[Dan Schulz]

Tredosoft Multiple IE Standalones (http://www.tredosoft.com/Multiple_IE)
Firefox (http://www.getfirefox.com)
Opera Browser (http://www.opera.com/download)
Safari 3 Beta for Windows (http://www.apple.com/safari) (Assuming you're using Windows anyway.)

And a text editor. Oh, and a graphics program (Paint.NET (http://www.getpaint.net) is a freebie if you can't afford Photoshop and can't stand the look of The GIMP)

Now, my question to you is how much experience do you have making Web sites? Do you know what semantics are, the different roles of HTML (structure), CSS (appearance) and JavaScript (behavior/advanced interaction/form pre-validation), as well as accessibility, usability and SEO?

If not, then go to your local public library and ask them if they either have or can get on loan a copy of Build Your Own Web Site The Right Way Using HTML & CSS (http://www.sitepoint.com/books/html1) by Ian Lloyd. Work through the book (it's not a "sit down and read" type of book - it will make you work, though in small, managable and bite-sized chunks), and learn what you can from it. If you have any questions afterword, feel free to ask on the forums either here or at SitePoint (I'm a Mentor on the Design Team over there, so you KNOW I'll be able to answer any questions you have about it) and I'm sure someone will respond with some solid advice and/or a solution that works. :)

[44Reasons]

Tredosoft Multiple IE Standalones (http://www.tredosoft.com/Multiple_IE)
Firefox (http://www.getfirefox.com)
Opera Browser (http://www.opera.com/download)
Safari 3 Beta for Windows (http://www.apple.com/safari) (Assuming you're using Windows anyway.)

And a text editor. Oh, and a graphics program (Paint.NET (http://www.getpaint.net) is a freebie if you can't afford Photoshop and can't stand the look of The GIMP)

Now, my question to you is how much experience do you have making Web sites? Do you know what semantics are, the different roles of HTML (structure), CSS (appearance) and JavaScript (behavior/advanced interaction/form pre-validation), as well as accessibility, usability and SEO?

If not, then go to your local public library and ask them if they either have or can get on loan a copy of Build Your Own Web Site The Right Way Using HTML & CSS (http://www.sitepoint.com/books/html1) by Ian Lloyd. Work through the book (it's not a "sit down and read" type of book - it will make you work, though in small, managable and bite-sized chunks), and learn what you can from it. If you have any questions afterword, feel free to ask on the forums either here or at SitePoint (I'm a Mentor on the Design Team over there, so you KNOW I'll be able to answer any questions you have about it) and I'm sure someone will respond with some solid advice and/or a solution that works. :)
Thx for the great info dude,I really appreciate and I will definitely look into the book you mentioned.

But I also have questions about Xsitepro (http://www.Xsitepro.com)

[edrmjr]

Hey peeps,just made the final decision to be a penny pincher,so in short I want to download a free program that will make my job easier,or until I really know enough to be able to throw 150+ on a professionally built website.

I am currently Pre W3 school(been BSin alot,yeah I know thats bad) and will eventually be focusing more on my work this week.I know that before I focus on adwords,PPC or landing pages(money) I will have to really know the basics or my whole foundation will fall.

Please help...thx 44:cool:
I like Nvu. It has a lot of good features in it. I like how the GUI looks. It does have a somewhat steep learning curve though.

[risoknop]

I'd rather use notepad... it will be little bit harder to code everything by hand but the result will be better - cleaner, better organized code and easy to modify as you'll know your own code pretty well.

But Dreamweaver is pretty good.

[mutley]

i do make most of my code by hand but i do use dreamwaver sometimes it make my life easer

but if you want a free WSIWYG the yes NVU (http://reviews.supermegadownloads.co.uk/index.php?action=review&rid=35)

until you get good and then you may want to get dreamwaver but the best thing you can do is learn to code in notepad i just use things like Dramwaver and NVU to see some of my divs in a coding view so i can tell what it going to look like before i look in a Browser

but be a smart coder and code by hand you will end up making better code :p

[Dan Schulz]

Thx for the great info dude,I really appreciate and I will definitely look into the book you mentioned.

But I also have questions about Xsitepro (http://www.Xsitepro.com)

The code it produces looks worse than a landfill the size of Manhattan which makes the sites inaccessible to those with disabilities, those who prefer to navigate sites via the keyboard (AutisticCuckoo over at SitePoint is one of the keyboard navigation users), and also is NOT search engine friendly for various reasons (inability to use proper markup, keyword stuffing, and so on).

In other words, don't waste your money on it.

[44Reasons]

The code it produces looks worse than a landfill the size of Manhattan which makes the sites inaccessible to those with disabilities, those who prefer to navigate sites via the keyboard (AutisticCuckoo over at SitePoint is one of the keyboard navigation users), and also is NOT search engine friendly for various reasons (inability to use proper markup, keyword stuffing, and so on).

In other words, don't waste your money on it.
You just saved me 200 dollars dude,thx alot man.:):)

I just started W3 school and it's not as hard as I thought it was.I'm probably going to write all the codes in a notebook and take it with me everywhere I go and hopefully I could start making my own websites by next week.

Thx for the help and support people

[Dan Schulz]

Well, I wouldn't trust W3School's CSS section. Instead, you might want to look at The Ultimate CSS Reference (http://reference.sitepoint.com/css/) [link: reference.sitepoint.com]

[darklady]

I prefer notepad++ ... Yeah it takes a bit longer, but to me it is worth it if you need to fix any validation problems. Plus if you are trying to styles something like a forum, you will want to not use Dreamweaver or so because it tends to close all the open html tags if you do not know how to set it not to.

[SitPoMk]

Dreamweaver is good, but I don't even use the WYSIWYG. Hand coding is the way to go for website design.

It feels good to use notepad but it doesn't have highlighting, good formating, decent tabbing and stuff which is why I like Dreamweaver.

Plus it's got FTP, XML support, CSS formating, live data support, site manager, testing server stuff, the new SPRY framework(which I'm not too fond of but i know many people are), and basically everything you would want while designing a website. And ofcourse great sync with other CS apps.

It's kind of like the all-in-one-one-stop-shop-never-leave-the-program-hub. If that's what you're into but again ... it isn't free so it helps you none

There are good free programs like CoffeeCup, Aptana, NVu, AceHTML(never heard of it but read it on this thread), and others which im not aware of

Good luck and remember that many great applications were done with the smallest and most common tools

[MrsMildredPierce]

I'm using a free program called Web Dwarf, I like it because you can drag and drop graphics and such. Very good for someone like me who basically knows nothing.
I just did a Page 2 for my website but I don't know how to upload the file or anything. LOL

[webrehash]

Dreamweaver is what I use, only because I'm not a code guru. I can tweak code as needed, but I use DW more for the ease of managing the site rather than the WYSIWYG capabilities (which aren't accurate all the time). I build alot of PHP/ASP sites with backend client administration and find WebAssist extensions (http://www.webrehash.com/super-suite.html) save a ton of time. There is some overlap with ADDT though.

[kk5st]

There's been some good suggestions, but I'll wade in anyway. ;)

You need a good text editor. There's a bunch of free ones out there for the taking. My preference is Emacs for its absolute power, but a lot of people fight shy of it for the same reason.

Work through some tutorials. Add htmldog.com to your list.

Get GIMP. It's not as powerful as PhotoShop, but you won't need the print oriented stuff, anyway. GIMP is built from the ground up for web graphics.

Get Inkscape. It's a free vector graphics application; think Illustrator.

You'll need to set up a local web server. Get Apache, PHP5 and MySQL. If you're on Windows, Google wamp (windows/apache/mysql/php). All are free. You'll need the PHP and MySQL for nearly all CMS apps.

You absolutely do not need wysiwyg html generators, eg. Dreamweaver.

cheers,

gary

[SitPoMk]

You absolutely do not need wysiwyg html generators, eg. Dreamweaver.


but that's not all Dreamweaver is
if you look at all the features of Dreamweaver, the wysiwyg is only a fraction of the strengths of dreamweaver

think xml, javascript, site management, testing, live data connection ...

[SitPoMk]

forgot to mention ..

the great community and tutorials which grew for dreamweave over the years. Dreamweaver has grown to be partially synonymous to web design. So while a tutorial may consist of just basic HTML stuff. It will be called a "dreamweaver tutorial" rather than just an "html tutorial"

[Dan Schulz]

but that's not all Dreamweaver is
if you look at all the features of Dreamweaver, the wysiwyg is only a fraction of the strengths of dreamweaver

think xml, javascript, site management, testing, live data connection ...

Which someone who knows how to write code by hand (such as myself) will tell you is bloated to the point of it being a miracle that it even works in the first place. As for testing, that's what IE 6, IE 7, Firefox, Opera (http://www.opera.com/download), and Safari (http://www.apple.com/safari) are for.

forgot to mention ..

the great community and tutorials which grew for dreamweave over the years. Dreamweaver has grown to be partially synonymous to web design. So while a tutorial may consist of just basic HTML stuff. It will be called a "dreamweaver tutorial" rather than just an "html tutorial"

Which can be covered for far less than the $400 asking price of Dreamweaver right here (http://www.sitepoint.com/books/html1).

[SitPoMk]

Dan - I'm not saying dreamweaver is the ideal option. It's far from it. I'm a coder also, a programmer at heart. ;) But for someone who wants to learn "How to build a website" it probably is best not to shove some HTML, PHP, MySQL, CSS, JS in their face and go here .. learn! hehe That's what I'm saying is that for someone new to this, dreamweaver(or free and open source alternatives as i discussed earlier in this thread) is optimal.
btw dude I live in naperville! =P

[Dan Schulz]

Dan - I'm not saying dreamweaver is the ideal option. It's far from it. I'm a coder also, a programmer at heart. ;) But for someone who wants to learn "How to build a website" it probably is best not to shove some HTML, PHP, MySQL, CSS, JS in their face and go here .. learn! hehe That's what I'm saying is that for someone new to this, dreamweaver(or free and open source alternatives as i discussed earlier in this thread) is optimal.

I cut my teeth on Dreamweaver MX. I hated it. Once I was exposed to a book that showed me how to properly write HTML and CSS in bite sized chunks (that also had pictures of the results and code examples as well) I took off like a rocket. I still hate JavaScript though (don't use it) and am currently cutting my teeth on PHP and MySQL via WordPress (I've created my own WordPress master theme template that literally cuts out all the crap - it's currently in beta testing right now).


btw dude I live in naperville! =P

Heh. I'm a mile south of the casino myself. :cool:

[CT SEO]

Definitely dreamweaver... but alas it is not free.

[SitPoMk]

Wow good point brought up, why haven't we dicussed CMS's like Wordpress, Joomla, Drupal, and BANS and stuff

They definitely don't take programming experience if you don't want them too
And they do usually dominate as the website system of choice

[Dan Schulz]

Well, the thing with those particular systems is that they have multiple people working on them - which invariablly leads to bloated code. And in my case, I don't have the time to manually update my sites' content, so I'm relying on WordPress as a CMS to handle it for me until I'm comfortable enough with PHP and MySQL to literally write my own custom-content management system (which I'll then be able to sell), which as you're well aware of, is NOT an easy feat or a task for the timid/inexperienced developer/programmer.

[TechnoGeek]

For people who like to hand code their pages, I would recommend the free tool CSE HTML Validator Lite.

http://www.htmlvalidator.com/lite/

[kk5st]

You absolutely do not need wysiwyg html generators, eg. Dreamweaver.but that's not all Dreamweaver is
if you look at all the features of Dreamweaver, the wysiwyg is only a fraction of the strengths of dreamweaver

think xml, javascript, site management, testing, live data connection ...
XML is just a markup language; no need for an expensive application.

DW's javascript is abysmal. There is just no excuse for its crudity. There are plenty of javascript repositories just brimming with intelligently written code, or one can learn to use some of the excellent libraries such as jQuery.

Good site management depends on a well architected site plan. Combine that with a mirror site on the development server, and it becomes trivial to maintain site synchronization. Page control depends on the same things plus sane usage of included common bits, and back end controls for dynamic content management.

I have no idea what you mean by a 'live data connection' in this context.

cheers,

gary

[Stomme poes]

He might mean the ftp thing-- I read a thread on SitePoint where true hand-coders were using Dreambeaver to speed up stuff they'd rather not do by hand-- stuff they well knew HOW to do but they liked the "extras" that the programme came with.

I'm glad I never started with a WYSIWYG cause I'm a visual person and I woulda never broken out of it.

Dan, have you tried out that Simply Javascript book? I'm kinda sorta thinking I should learn JS (as much as I want to puke every time I see it on a website) and I saw the name bandied about... but as you're struggling with JS still... should I get it? I have zero code experience, just a husband who writes in Perl who rants about "elegance" and "beauty" etc... and is it written for someone coming from web design?

[SitPoMk]

XML is just a markup language; no need for an expensive application.

DW's javascript is abysmal. There is just no excuse for its crudity. There are plenty of javascript repositories just brimming with intelligently written code, or one can learn to use some of the excellent libraries such as jQuery.

Good site management depends on a well architected site plan. Combine that with a mirror site on the development server, and it becomes trivial to maintain site synchronization. Page control depends on the same things plus sane usage of included common bits, and back end controls for dynamic content management.

I have no idea what you mean by a 'live data connection' in this context.

cheers,

gary


I meant that you have a live view of your database called "Live data view"
Also, good catch! I cant believe i forgot FTP.

Now I see where you're coming from, and just in case you havent read my other posts in this thread, please do so as they explain my view of DW. In short, I am like you I assume. I do everything manually for more control and to be on top of things better. But it almost sounds as if you're trying to invalidate dreamweaver as a useful tool.

It's not optimal, but it works. And is useful for very many webmasters out there. that's all I'm getting at here ;)

[Dan Schulz]

Mallory, I OWN a copy of that book, and while it was good at first, it just went down-hill from there (at least for me). Of course, that nice shiny Mentor badge at SitePoint is keeping me from speaking further about it...

[kk5st]

<snip> I have zero code experience, just a husband who writes in Perl who rants about "elegance" and "beauty" etc. …
Perl? Elegance? Beauty? Only if he defines innately obfuscated as elegant and beautiful. :D

cheers,

gary

[Stomme poes]

Heh, cause there's more than one way to do it : ) But the Perl Monks say it can be done : )

Dan, by downhill, do you mean how it was written or how your brain tries to wrap around it? Apparently being able to think for CSS means awful for programming, it seems.

NM, I'll PM you if you can't speak publicly.

[kk5st]

I meant that you have a live view of your database called "Live data view"
Totally unnecessary. If you need to view data during development, use the DBMS client and query for the results you need. This is the kind of thing done during DB schema development, and is not a front end function. A good text editor like Emacs allows you to run the application from within a buffer, if you like.

<snip>But it almost sounds as if you're trying to invalidate dreamweaver as a useful tool.
I guess I am. Its site management tools might be considered helpful if it were not for creating vendor lock-in with proprietary methods. A good site management plan is platform agnostic.

It's not optimal, but it works. And is useful for very many webmasters out there. that's all I'm getting at here ;)
In the same way a crutch is helpful. HTML and css are too simple to require a crutch unless one has decided to remain crippled. (Or, just likes to spend money on unnecessary software.)

cheers,

gary

ps. Sorry about the delay replying. Somehow I missed the updates. --g