Testing Waters - 3.5 Year old Automotive Site

[Spendlessly]

I would like to test the waters on a site of mine that I purchased and began to build over 3 years ago. The URL is http://www.dragsource.com

I do not have a starting price, or a BIN - but I will entertain serious offers. This is my first time selling a site, so I am trying to get an idea of what it is worth - but I am prepared to sell. I have several other sites that have taken a priority recently, and have to force myself to move on. The site started as a hobby, and grew until it consumed my local area. Every automotive enthusiast in my city - and even my state, generally knows of the site by name. The site has done promoting for local drag racing tracks, and I frequently receive offers in regards to being a parts distributior. (I haven't entertained any of them as I wanted to avoid drop shipping things) It has grown over the years, and continues to grow quickly -

The site consists of articles, which I wrote. Calculators, that I coded. A very active forum with 1000+ registered users. Several subsections where users can upload pictures of their cars with descriptions (write content for you), and also upload pictures from shows they've gone to, etc.

I didn't record statistics until part way through 2004, so that is where they begin.

http://www.dragsource.com/ss/2004.jpg

http://www.dragsource.com/ss/2005.jpg

http://www.dragsource.com/ss/jan06.jpg

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Below are my actual earnings with AdSense for this month, up to the time of this post. I use both AdSense and Yahoo on the site currently. AdSense on the main site/articles/content, and Y! on the forums. My total for this month as of today with Yahoo is $222.29

http://www.dragsource.com/ss/janas.jpg

The ONLY portion of the site that IS NOT included is the DS Productions section. That is a business owned by another individual, it and the videos under that section will be moved to another domain prior to the sale, and are not included. All other videos were created by me, and do come with the site (archived videos section)

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I will entertain questions publicly - fire away.


Question: How much work is required.

Answer: The registered rides section is fully automated. When someone uploads a "ride" it doesn't show in with the rest of them until they upload at least one image of it. Currently the only way to edit the rides in there is through the MySQL database - however I could whip up an administration page prior to sale.

The member timeslips section is fully editable using the admin panel in PHPBB.

The past events section is automated to the point that - when someone submits an event, it waits in queue until it is reviewed and approved. (once agin, no admin page - it is done by changing a "n" to a "y" in the MySQL database - and once again, I could put together an admin page prior to sale upon request)

The archived pictures section is dynamically generated. To add pictures to it you do have to manually upload the image, and type a description of it into the MySQL database - I would be willing to make a simple upload form prior to sale.

The archived videos section is the same as the archived pictures section ^^

The DS Drag Racer game is fully automated, and has active players daily.

Everything on the site is stored in SQL databases for easy re-arranging/reformating.

[joeychgo]

images not showing up

[petertdavis]

I will entertain questions publicly, so long as the question is not what the domain name is. Serious inquiries only please.
We can't ask what the domain is? How is anyone supposed to say anything about it without knowing the domain? Honestly!

[Spendlessly]

You make a good point, perhaps I am being too restrictive of the URL. I have amended my initial post to include the URL of the site.

[petertdavis]

One thought that comes to me, since you mentioned it has a good regional branding you'd probably maximize your selling potential to sell the site to someone within that region. I'd seriously recommend contacting a business broker who specializes in that region. People here would be mostly likely to pay a multiple of your monthly profits for it, but someone looking for that kind of name recognition in your region may find the brand more valuable than the profits. Just a thought.

[Spendlessly]

Thanks for the suggestion peter - *newbie taking notes*

[Spendlessly]

I am receiving several PM's requesting an amount that I have in mind.

I honestly have no idea where to begin, and obviously don't want to sell myself short. I have interest at $4,000 - I would like to see if there are any others interested, and will consider an auction if I receive additional offers.

[PGZ]

Your site is worth alot more than $4000....Dont sell yourself short. With the traffic you are getting and the revenue that is there at this point your looking at alot more than your interest.

Im sure many here will agree with me.

PGZ

[joeychgo]

Your site is worth alot more than $4000....Dont sell yourself short. With the traffic you are getting and the revenue that is there at this point your looking at alot more than your interest.

Im sure many here will agree with me.

PGZ

Hmm - you offering more then $4k?

[PGZ]

Hmm - you offering more then $4k?

No cause I dont have the money right now but was just being honest with the guy so he isnt taken advantage of......Something wrong with that ??

I mean as of right now its bringing in over $600 a month just in Google and Yahoo ads.

Its a PR4 with really good traffic so Im sure banner ads could be sold along with text links to bring in even more money per month.

Another site with somewhat same stats just sold for $12,500

He asked what people thought it was worth and I just answered the question that was asked.

Just my opinion though..

PGZ

[honey]

I think the site is worth what a buyer is going to pay. Just like a house which maybe worth a million $$, but if you are only getting $500,000 and that's the best standing offer, it's your call to decide whether you want to sell it or not. But I understand, as you said, you are testing waters because websites are always case to case. I have bought and sold a lot of websites, and I will probably keep doing if the demand and supply ratio is good, and I would say that I have sold sites making nothing for as much as $5000 and sites making $300 a month as low as $2000. The thing is, since website incomes are usually not predictable for a longer future and rely on so many factors in the competitive nature of the web, websites may sell for more then 10-12x maybe 40x or 2x...basically difficult to say.

[emil2k]

No cause I dont have the money right now but was just being honest with the guy so he isnt taken advantage of......Something wrong with that ??

I mean as of right now its bringing in over $600 a month just in Google and Yahoo ads.

Its a PR4 with really good traffic so Im sure banner ads could be sold along with text links to bring in even more money per month.

Another site with somewhat same stats just sold for $12,500

He asked what people thought it was worth and I just answered the question that was asked.

Just my opinion though..

PGZ

What is this site that made around 600/month sold for $12,500? And who is the buyer :D

[PGZ]

What is this site that made around 600/month sold for $12,500? And who is the buyer :D

You mean I have to go find it for you and its right here in this forum....Come on man read just like I would have to. If I remembered the thread then I would of posted it but it is in this forum.

It sold on another site for 12,500 but was listed here also.

PGZ

[MountainLife]

Listen the site's worth what it's worth.

The revenue has to be proven, you're removing videos and part of the site upon sale, so revenuye should be expected to go down no matter what the seller says because of course they'll say it won't go down. I'm semi interested but you'll have to be realisitic, also you posted revenue showing 400 something not 600, always amazes me when revenues go up the mopnth someone wants to sell the site. I'll check this out and see where we get.. also for 3 years it only has 13 bl's? Keep in mind it's always the guy who doesn't have the money to buy it who'll say it worth more lol


side note just found something funny

http://web.archive.org/web/20031226043339/http://www.dragsource.com/

[Spendlessly]

Yep. It was hacked a long time ago. I found it amusing myself - but probably not as amusing as you ;)

[joeychgo]

All things to consider. Also, forums can be tricky. Members can stop returning as often just because their 'buddy' who owned the site isnt around anymore. I've seen it happen many times.

Listen the site's worth what it's worth.

The revenue has to be proven, you're removing videos and part of the site upon sale, so revenuye should be expected to go down no matter what the seller says because of course they'll say it won't go down. I'm semi interested but you'll have to be realisitic, also you posted revenue showing 400 something not 600, always amazes me when revenues go up the mopnth someone wants to sell the site. I'll check this out and see where we get.. also for 3 years it only has 13 bl's? Keep in mind it's always the guy who doesn't have the money to buy it who'll say it worth more lol


side note just found something funny

http://web.archive.org/web/20031226043339/http://www.dragsource.com/

[MountainLife]

Yeah i agree, i'm interested but see quite a bit of loss potential, not worth what he's asking.. but we'll see what comes about

[westhaven]

do tell me if u are intrested in selling your site.

[PGZ]

Keep in mind it's always the guy who doesn't have the money to buy it who'll say it worth more lol

Ok whatever man......I forgot your the expert. Go ahead try to get it for nothing why dont ya.....

Of course you will disagree with me because you are interested in it....I have nothing to gain or lose by my words.....You on the other hand cant say the same because you want it.

Now with those 2 comparisons who do you think will be more honest about it...You or Me ???

Nuff said..

PGZ

[Sem-Advance]

Real world sales of business has shown the new owners upon takeover can expect to lose 25% of revenue. the first year.

Also you can look in the JoelComm thread to see doctored Adsense stats...

Definite limit in worldwide appeal...mostly US market....keyword valuations of adsense ads would not appear to be high paying terms.

So to grow revenues you must drive traffic at this point. Losing parts hurts as well.

However the games thing is a bonus with nice stickiness.

Domain name is good value.

Could you give average page views per user??

Average length of time user is on the site??

Thank you

[Spendlessly]

Listen the site's worth what it's worth.

The revenue has to be proven, you're removing videos and part of the site upon sale, so revenuye should be expected to go down no matter what the seller says because of course they'll say it won't go down. I'm semi interested but you'll have to be realisitic, also you posted revenue showing 400 something not 600, always amazes me when revenues go up the mopnth someone wants to sell the site. I'll check this out and see where we get.. also for 3 years it only has 13 bl's? Keep in mind it's always the guy who doesn't have the money to buy it who'll say it worth more lol


side note just found something funny

http://web.archive.org/web/20031226043339/http://www.dragsource.com/

In regards to the section that is not included. It consists of 4 videos. It has received 443 pageviews this month so far... not exactly the meat and potatoes of the site, more a hosting favor for a close personal friend.

Here is the other revenue from this month.

http://www.dragsource.com/ss/jany.jpg

As you can see from to screen shots I posted, this has been my busiest month (in terms of unique visitors) ever. Revenue has followed suit. It wasn't until about 7 or 8 months ago that I began actively trying to rank in the search engines. It wasn't that I didn't want to rank, I just didn't know how. I found WMW and DP and began to apply my knowledge, and I've had ups and downs... but more ups.

I had the revenue on a steady climb until Jagger. The site took a big hit in the SERPS, and I saw a lot of URL only action. Luckily, Google Images picked up the slack - and then some. I've been watching the Big Daddy servers, and as of current (crossing fingers) all of the content pages are back in the SERPS and ranking as they were before - but I take the Big Daddy results with a grain of salt, as it's all speculation as to weather or not filters/etc have been applied. Although it would be nice to have substantial traffic coming from Google content search as well as Google images. After Jagger, I implimented a site wide 301 redirect in hopes that my www/non-www issues would be resolved in time.

Here is an image of what my referral/direct visitor statistics looked like back in September of 2005. I believe Jagger hit me on the 22nd of Sept.

http://www.dragsource.com/ss/sept05visits.jpg

Here is an image of what my referral/direct visitor statistics look like for the current month up to the time of this post.

http://www.dragsource.com/ss/jan06visits.jpg

In regards to the backlinks. I wish I knew what Googles definition of a backlink was... and if they are showing them all to us. If a backlink is a link from the "main page" of a site - it is very possible that there could be as little as 13. I haven't made much of an effort to exchange links.

And for the money shot - my earnings since I started with AdSense back in September of 2004. I just recently started with Yahoo at the end of October, and I gave Chitika a test run but wasn't pleased and have since removed it.

http://www.dragsource.com/ss/earnings.jpg

There you have it - I'm naked (received PM offering $5,000 shortly ago)

[RectangleMan]

Ok whatever man......I forgot your the expert. Go ahead try to get it for nothing why dont ya.....

Of course you will disagree with me because you are interested in it....I have nothing to gain or lose by my words.....You on the other hand cant say the same because you want it.

Now with those 2 comparisons who do you think will be more honest about it...You or Me ???

Nuff said..

PGZ

I am not really interesting in this either so is my opinion objective? I don't think this site is anywhere near $12.5k value. Maybe 6-8k but a $4k offer isn't that bad either. It's an initial offer and obviously in a auction it can go higher. A site is only worth what someone will pay. I wouldn't pay $12k for this. Someone might but not me. If he had a buy it now of $5k...I would take it asap...7k buy it now..someone else might. I think you can get 6k or more on this so goodluck.

[Spendlessly]

Current best offer stands at $5,250.

[MountainLife]

with avg revenue of 200-300/month i'm really doubting those offers

[Sem-Advance]

Yes... me too ;)

[Spendlessly]

You are entitled to your doubts. In the mean time, I have received more than one $5,000 offer - and as it currently stands - $5,250 as the best offer.

I will be consulting a local broker on Monday, and see if I get any offers from that angle - if not... I will make up my mind by the following weekend as to weather I should hang on to it or sell.

I appreciate your offers and feedback folks. Thanks to those who have PM'ed words of wisdom - I appreciate you taking the time to educate a first timer.

Edit - in researching proper website sales etiquette, I have learned that it is proper to list the Registrar and expiration date:

GoDaddy
Expire: August 2006

Sorry for not including that in my original post.

[Spendlessly]

I have made my decision to sell to the best offer received prior to Next Sunday at 12 AM Central time (feb 5th). So I am no longer "testing the waters" - it's going to someone.

Current BO stands at $5,250 -

Thanks for your time and consideration.

[joeychgo]

The bids should be publicly posted.

Otherwise we dont know if the bids are genuine.

[Spendlessly]

Sem-Advance made the offer of $5,250

[diamondsinfo]

Just curious if you have ever had any legal issues with the site? Some may interpret parts of the site as encouraging or glamorizing street racing which is illegal.

I think the site has lots of revenue potential and am interested, but I worry about the legal side a bit.

[xoticpt]

i run a website of similar fashion. there are no issues with such illegal content as you put it.

[Spendlessly]

I have never had any legal issues with it. In fact - at one point in time an inside source from the Des Moines police department brought it to my attention that an officer tried to use a video from the site to obtain a warrant to prosecute the person in the video, and it was shot down.

It's been smooth sailing.

[Spendlessly]

I am no longer testing the waters on this site - please see the Auction at http://forums.digitalpoint.com/showthread.php?t=54623